In the process of doing my timing chain.  I got the balancer off (and water pump and all other accessories) and now I'm ready to drop the pan.  My Haynes manual told me to set the engine at #1 TDC before pulling the balancer, but the pan drop procedure (I read it after I pulled the balancer) says to rotate the engine such that the timing mark points straight down.  What's up with that???  Do I need to rotate the engine?  I would think I want it at #1 TDC to do the chain.  Will there be clearance problems with the crank if I don't set the engine the way the Haynes manual says?  

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A full/true roller is best, but not 100% necessary. My thoughts are do it once, and do it right.  A roller will fit under the stock cover easily.

You can set the timing marks on the cam gear and crank gear pointing towards each other, and swap the chain/gear with no problems. As long as the engine isn't turned with the chain off, you're good. I think the manual wants the engine with the timing mark DOWN to make it easier to get the pan off past the crank throws, but on a Shark car, it's pretty much a straight down deal.


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Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    
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"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"

Thanks guys.  Yep, I checked - on the oil pan procedure it specifically says, "Turn the crankshaft until the timing mark on the vibration damper is pointed straight down."  (Step 9) Still doesn't make sense - it tells you to remove the crossover pipe (mine's already gone) and the idler arm and lower steering linkage (I'm assuming they're correct there - not much clearance) and starter.  Once you remove all that stuff there's nothing blocking the path of the pan at all.  I got the car up on stands tonight and the starter and flywheel cover off tonight.  Will do the rest one night this week hopefully.  Then it's putting everything back together.....

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Yup...drop the idle arm, and disconnect the linkage from the driver side, and you'll have plenty of room to drop the pan.
Ken(kstyer) changed the whole crankshaft in his car, with the engine still in the car, so dropping the pan isn't that tough of a job.


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Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    
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"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"

Agreed!  Changing the crank in the car sounds like too much fun for me.  I'll count my blessings if I can get this "simple" project put back together.  Unfortunately, time is my main limiting factor these days....  Thanks for the help.

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We're rootin for ya Dave!! You can do it!!!

Glad someone's rooting for me!  So I got the pan off (dang, 2-bolt main - was hoping to get lucky) and now I have more questions.

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Use a straight edge, and align it with the center of the crank, and cam, straight up and down. That will show you where the gears are.
The 12/6 debate will continue, of course, but I've always used the crank @ 12, cam @ 6...basically having the marks facing each other. It's easiest for me to see that the marks are spot on like that.
Don't know that you would need a crow bar to turn the cam, but a medium-sized screwdriver should do it, if needed.


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Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    
My Link


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"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"

Wow that sounds fun!! I have never done a chain with both sprockets at 12:00..??Knee jerk reaction would be that the cam is really on the exhaust stroke??  which valve starts to move when you trun the crank a little..(clockwise)I bet the exhaust valve moves..if not I had a long last night and a long day!!!The brain has been off since friday around noon!!The race way is to use a degree wheel..lot a work and not really needed for a driver that doesn't have an adjustable cam gear!!

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My first parade at Carlisle 2010

Rich,
I remember a post where there was and is still an ongoing question about where the timing marks should be. https://www.c3vr.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=78597&OB=DESC
This is the link to the discussion. Let many others here I also always make marks at 12 and 6. Interesting conversation in these posts!
Rodney


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when you go for a new oil pan gasket; the one piece Felpro's work great.

Re: the debate about 12/12 or 12/6: In the other thread someone came to the conclusion that it doesn't really matter -- either one works.  If both of mine were at 12:00 and I rotated the cam to 6:00, #1 is still on TDC, but it would simply "change" to the exhaust stroke from the compression stroke. (And I am sure it was on compression when I took everything apart) It becomes more complicated for me, though, as my distributor (and manifold) is out as well.  If I rotated my cam 180 degrees now, I would have to install the dist exactly 180 out when I put it back in.  So I'm going to line up the new timing set with a straightedge as Joel says and hope I get it right.  If the distributor were in, rotating the cam would take care of rotating the dist and everything would be fine.  Anyway....

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Yep, already got the one piece Felpro - seems like it'll be a lot easier than the older four piece things...

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Well its Tuesday morning! I would replace the pump if you have it taken apart as far as you do..when you pick up the pump see if it has that plastic line up collar for the pump to shaft..those do fall apart at times...and a pump gasket..maybe since this is so far apart you could do the plugs and wires like Ebo! Is that gasket a neoprene style or cork..oil pan gasket? Cork worked good if you glue it on with that black airplane glue.. I like the neoprene though..I will let the gear thing die because it really doesn't matter unless you are trying to line up the distributor.
Rich




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My first parade at Carlisle 2010

I think my original pump still has the collar (there's an orange sleeve thing on the shaft) but I'll probably get all new stuff.  Plugs and wires should be OK now, but I do agree having all this stuff off would make that job much easier.  The one piece Felpro is not cork and I don't think it's neoprene, either.  It's a blue rubber material on the outside, but it has some type of rigid spine inside.  The bolt holes have metal reinforcements.  I've talked with a few folks now that recommend them.  

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Back to the 12/6 debate.  If you do not remove your distributor, it doesn't matter at all which way you line up the marks.  The cam runs a half the crank speed, and the distributor runs off the cam.  It is correct that if you put the cam at 12:00, #1 will be on the top of the exhaust stroke rather than the firing position, but the distributor has turned with it, so # 6 will be firing.  The only time you need think about firing is if you take out the distributor, in which case you need to start over and turn the engine to #1 firing before reinstalling the distributor.

Larry

I agree, but my distributor IS out. 

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                Sorry All,

              Sorry All,

I solved my problem by installing the intake manifold and then distributor first and THEN doing the timing chain stuff.  I put the dist in exactly the way I took it out and then was free to rotate the engine so the marks align at 6 and 12.  Then I took the old gear off and put the new stuff on.  BUT...with the marks at 6 and 12, the dist rotor points at the #6 cylinder position, NOT #1 telling me that the engine is set at TDC with #6 on compression, not #1 (#1 is at TDC, exhaust).   

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