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Topic: Brake Dust with 'O' ringed calipers?

in Forum: C3 Handling Components


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Brake Dust with 'O' ringed calipers? (1/5)
 7/28/15 6:25pm
johnu
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Scottsdale, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1981 Corvette Two-Tone Claret color, 4 spd, C7 Vert


Joined: 5/23/2007
Posts: 614

10 plus years ago I replaced my OEM calipers (yes, 24 years+ on the originals) with sleeved and "O"ringed replacements.  I used the pads that came in the kit for 10 years putting up with the dust they produced on all 4 wheels.  Last year I replaced those pads with some Hawks that have a good review for no dust.  Those dust on me too.
Question:  Are the "O" rings so tight as to prevent the pistons from retracting enough to get the pads away from the disks?  All hoses were replaced so that rule outs old closed hoses not releasing. 


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Re: Brake Dust with 'O' ringed calipers? (2/5)
 7/28/15 10:41pm
Adams' AppleLifetime Member
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Duncanville, TX - USA

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#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas


Joined: 11/8/2003
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The pistons are designed to hold a small amount of pressure on the pads at all times. The normal out of round, or wobble in the rotor will usually knock the pads back just enough to not be a wear issue while driving. I've had the same Raybestos pads on my '74 since '97, and I've never really noticed any brake dust on the rims to speak of.If you got 10 years of service out of the pads that came with the calipers, I'd have to say there's not mush of a wear issue from the o-rings holding the pads too tight against the rotors. The dusting is something that is going to occur regardless. You could get a set of DUST SHIELDS if it really bothers ya that much. Lottsa folks have them for that reason.

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Re: Brake Dust with 'O' ringed calipers? (3/5)
 7/28/15 11:42pm
johnu
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Scottsdale, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1981 Corvette Two-Tone Claret color, 4 spd, C7 Vert


Joined: 5/23/2007
Posts: 614

Maybe I'll try some OEM pads which were probably on it when I purchased it with 19,000 miles on it.  The next 20,000 miles/14 years I owned it were dust free.  For the last 10 yrs/10,000 miles a 25 mile drive around town covers the wheels with a layer of brown dust.  I'll have to pull the receipt, I was thinking the pads are a ceramic compound.

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Re: Brake Dust with 'O' ringed calipers? (4/5)
 7/30/15 4:58pm
kstyerLifetime Member
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CUYAHOGA FALLS, OH - USA

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1975 C3 Red, T-Tops, Black Interior. All I need is time and money! Getting there!


Joined: 12/2/2003
Posts: 6424

Been trying to answer this for 3 days.  Computer problems.

The original seals in our calipers were a cup type seal.  They seal well when pressure is applied inside, but can leak easily when pressure is reversed.  The advantage is a tighter seal as the cup section is pressed against the caliper bore when the brake pressure is applied.
O-ring seals do not do that.  The maintain equal piston to bore pressure (side to side) no matter how much pressure is applied.
 
While you don't get the additional sealing force with the 0-rings, you don't really need it.  Overall they are quite an improvement.  The cup seals when relaxed for a long period of time can actually allow air to enter the caliper.  This is why we often need to bleed our brakes after a winter nap.  O-ring seals won't do that.  If you need to bleed them it's for a different reason.
 
Neither seal has any tendency to retract the pistion.  New square cut seals will flex sideways when applied, and pull back a bit when released.  C3s don't have square cut.  In fact they have a spring behind each brake pistion to help keep  the pads out by the rotors.  Without the springs, the pistons will retract a bit due to road vibration, rotor flex on corners, etc.  After a run down the highway or a few wicked corners, the brake pedal can become very low.  You may need to pump the pedal one time, or several times to push the pistons back out to the pads and rotors.  That usually creates a real OH CRAP moment, then the car stops.
As Joel stated, the do get pushed back just a tad based on rotor warpage, and movements, but stay just brushing the rotors.
 
The brake dust is all about the pads.  Some do, some dont.  I have organic similar to OE and do not have a dust problem.   Ceramics usually don't dust, but that depends on the brand.  Semi Metallic will almost always give you dust.  Pads are not created equally.  All similar pads are not a pure mix, but a complex blend of many materials.  Ceramics and not all ceramic.  Every style of pad is a blend of many things.   This being the case, a blanket statement about which type may not be valid.  Name brands are a lot more specfic.
 
So which type of organic pad do I have on my car?  Please don't cringe,  They are from AutoZone.   And yes, I'm very pleased with their performance and lack of dust.   Are they great for everything, no.  But I don't go racing on track days, just drive on regular roads and highways.  (Okay sometimes you would think I'm on a track, but we won't talk about that).
Re: Brake Dust with 'O' ringed calipers? (5/5)
 7/30/15 8:22pm
johnu
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Scottsdale, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1981 Corvette Two-Tone Claret color, 4 spd, C7 Vert


Joined: 5/23/2007
Posts: 614

Thanks for the great info!!!  Since it started with a caliper change over I always wondered if additional drag from the "O" ring might be the cause.....too much thinking in my sleep!!!!
  I'll have to experiment with another pad.  Autozone gets good reviews on other sites.  I had Raybesto's best ceramic on a mini van and was totally dust free.  I put the same model pad on a car and it was a total disaster for dust.  I was talking with the factory chemist with photo's and he'd send different compounds for me to try and we never found the cure.  I went back to the OEM pad and the problem went away...go figure!


|UPDATED|7/30/2015 5:22:44 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


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