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Topic: no spark !!

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no spark !! (1/31)
 10/22/08 3:24pm
vettemojo87
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   I have a 1976 covette that has been sitting for 1yr - I went to start her the other day, but she will not start.  The car is turning over, but won't start - I did see that I am getting fuel, but no spark.  I have replaced the p/u coil, distributer cap, rotor, ignition module & ignition coil, but nothing has solved the problem - still no spark.  I also put a test light on the main iginition cable & I am getting power.  The battery is dead (of course) & I am trying to jump the car first, then I will purchase the new battery.  Please Please solve my problem.  Let me know if anyone requires further information.

 
Thanks for the help.
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no spark !! (2/31)
 10/22/08 4:05pm
Gunslinger
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I can only relate what happened to me and my '69 once. 

A similar thing occurred...no spark.  Everything looked correct but still no spark.  When I was inspecting everything, I had the chrome cover removed from the shielding around the distributor and coil, I decided to try again to start the car and it fired right up and ran fine...like nothing was ever wrong. 

To inspect everything again, I reached over the distributor...didn't touch it...and I got the electrical shock of my life!  I felt like I had to run into a dark room and check to see if my n_ts had turned into night lights! 

What had happened in my case at least, was a pinhole had formed in the coil wire boot and the spark was grounding out through the RFI shield cover instead of going through the distributor to the spark plugs.  When I had my hand near it the spark jumped to me. 

Replacing the coil wire boot fixed my problem.  I don't know if you have your RFI shield in place or not, so your problem could be completely different.  If your shielding is in place, try it without it.
no spark !! (3/31)
 10/22/08 4:27pm
vettemojo87
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Yes,
 the shielding has been removed.  Thanks for the info though.
no spark !! (4/31)
 10/22/08 7:24pm
kstyerLifetime Member
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Your car has an HEI distributor.  This is fairly easy to diagnosis.
 
Disconnect a few plug wires and crank the engine to make sure there is nothing coming out of the distributor.  You could just have bad plug wires, or shorting spark plugs.  Either one can happen after sitting.
 
First test for power on the red wire on the side of the cap with key on.  If that's okay, leave the wires connected and remove the cap.  You may need to pull some plug wires off the cap, but keep the wires on the side connected.
 
Make sure all of the small wires are in good condition.
Put a test light or dwell meter on the brown wire next to the red power wire.  This is the tach wire.  Crank the engine.  If you get a dwell reading or the test light flashed, the pickup and module is working properly. 
If so, hold a jumper wire near, but not touching, the center contact in the cap.   Crank the engine.  If it sparks, the rotor is shorted and stopping spark from leaving the distributor.  If it does not, replace the ignition coil.
 
If the brown wire did not pulse, disconnect distributor pick up connector from the ignition module.  With the key on, use a jumper or screwdrive tip and repeatedly touch one of the contacts on the module, pulsing it to ground.  If nothing happens, do the same thing with the other contact on the module for the pickup.  If the coil now fires, replace the pickup.  If it does not, replace the module.
 
Just one addition.  If you did not get the spark, before replacing anything, disconnect the brown wire from the cap and crank the engine.  If you get spark,  something is shorting the brown wire to ground.
 
 
That is all there is to the HEI.  Fairly simple once you know.  Feel free to ask more questions, and let me know what happens.
 
 
no spark !! (5/31)
 10/22/08 9:07pm
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no spark !! (6/31)
 10/23/08 10:25am
vettemojo87
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Thanks for the information.  I have already replaced the p/u coil, distributer cap, rotor, ignition module & ignition coil, but will retry all these tests again tonight.  Forgot to previously mention that I had replaced several spark plugs & wires (the easiest ones to get to).  hopefully it is the brown wire you speak about.  I will try tonight & let you know what happens.  Thanks Again.
no spark !! (7/31)
 10/23/08 1:15pm
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Make sure there is 12v+ on the large, red wire on the dist. cap connector while cranking. You can have voltage there with the key on, but loose it when you turn the key to the "crank" position. If you loose the voltage while cranking, you'll prolly need to check into the ign. switch, or a connector issue.

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no spark !! (8/31)
 10/23/08 7:54pm
acplus
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If you think that you have an issue with power on the red wire at the distributor you can pick up power using a jumper wire from the big red wire at the alt and connect it directly to the distibutor, this will give a test supply of power to see if it will start.
John
no spark !! (9/31)
 10/23/08 9:00pm
vettemojo87
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I tested the large red wire to the dist & in the on position it gives me 12+ volts.  When the ignition is turned to start the voltage falls to 6 volts.  I assume this means the ignition switch is bad ? or could it be more than this ?  I was looking in a repair manual & on the '76 it appears I need to drop the whole steering column.  I guess my first step is to try the test suggestion from acplus prior to dropping the steering column ?

no spark !! (10/31)
 10/23/08 9:36pm
acplus
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When you tested the voltage did you have it plug into the distibutor? Unplug it and try it. Then go to the other test from the alt
Sometimes after years,,,the ignition switch rod doesn't have the switch make full contact, while stand on you head you can try to straight it out a BIT, or push it towards the switch or try turning your ignition cylinder(key) on and off a feww extra times.... also check the plug at the switch for burn markings. And if you can check your supply voltage to the switch.
John
no spark !! (11/31)
 10/23/08 9:38pm
vettemojo87
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Thanks - will let you know the results.
no spark !! (12/31)
 10/23/08 10:05pm
acplus
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Let me know...good luck
no spark !! (13/31)
 10/24/08 10:51pm
kstyerLifetime Member
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IF you are dropping to 6 volts when cranking, see if you have the same voltage drop at the battery.  If so, you could just have a bad battery.  Or the starter is pulling WAY too much power.  Either way, the engine would be cranking slowly.
 
See if you have enough voltage at the battery connection at the alternator when cranking.  You need at least 9 volts at the dist and the alt both.  If not, but it cranks okay and the battery voltage at the battery is okay during cranking, then check the connectons at the starter and the fusiable links coming off of the starter.
 
If the alt voltage is good, but the dist voltage is low, look at the ignition switch.   At that point the suggestion of running a jumper from the alt to the dist would be a good easy test.
no spark !! (14/31)
 10/25/08 10:06am
eddie20875Lifetime Member
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try getting a new battery. sometimes with a dead battery such as yours a jump wont give it enough juice to start. i have had this happen on a couple of cars and once a new battery was in there was no problem. one car ran to auto store and would not start when i came out and it was showing spark. turned out the battery was bad and i even tried jumping it. good luck

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no spark !! (15/31)
 10/25/08 9:22pm
vettemojo87
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OK, here's the update.  Replaced the ignition switch - still no spark.  I tested the volts at the distrib. while jumping & the reading was 13 while on & then falls to 6 while cranking.  I received the same readings while jumping from the alt to the distrib.  I then removed the battery & noticed some corrosion.  I cleaned that up.  I went to the store & purchased a new battery on the advise from eddie20875 (thanks).  I replaced the battery & still no spark Angry.  I performed the same tets as above & the readings are now 11.75 while on & 9.50 while cranking.  I hope this info helps.  By now I think I've replaced everything except the wiring.  While it's been fun working on my baby, it's getting frustrating.
no spark !! (16/31)
 10/25/08 9:52pm
acplus
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Do you have spark at the plug wire terminal at the distibutor? Or no spark at the end of the wires? Need to maybe start to check for ground problems.... is the little wire that attaches to the coil with the 1/4" bolt grounded? and make sure that where the connectors go on are not bent over and not making contact.
John
no spark !! (17/31)
 10/25/08 11:17pm
vettemojo87
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I have no spark at the plugs.  How should I test for spark at the distrib ?  The little wire appears to be grounded & I don't see any of these connectors being bent.  Is there a test I can do with my digital meter to make sure it's grounded properly ?
no spark !! (18/31)
 10/25/08 11:28pm
eddie20875Lifetime Member
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is it possible you installed a bad ignition module? maybe too much of the diseletric grease or not enough? this is a strange problem. sorry that the battery advice didn't work

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no spark !! (19/31)
 10/26/08 1:00am
vettemojo87
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I bought the ignition module new from the parts store...I guess I could do a check on it to make sure it's good....I didn't use any grease...should I have ? where does the grease go...what is it used for ? no problem on the battery, I needed a new one anyway & right about now I'm willing to try all options.

no spark !! (20/31)
 10/26/08 2:07am
rraider1
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The greas goes on the back of the module, its helps tramsfer heat from the module to the case, you might double check the contact and seal  between the coil and the cap
no spark !! (21/31)
 10/26/08 9:18am
eddie20875Lifetime Member
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brian, there should have been a small packet of the dieselectric grease in with the module. besides transfering the heat i believe it also helps conduct the currents thru it. when you remove the ignition module make sure to clean the plate wher it mounts and the bottom of the module good. coat the plate with a very thin layer of the grease and reinstall the module. hope this works for you.


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no spark !! (22/31)
 10/26/08 10:29pm
acplus
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To test spark at the plug terminal at the distributor remove sprk plug wire at the distributor.... have a test light, and a wire with clips on each end.
Attach the wire to good ground (alt ground) take the other end of the wire and connect it to the test probe of the test light. with someone cranking it over bring the probe with the ground wire attached close to the terminal and see if you have a spark. Be careful only hold the handle part of the test light (wear some rubber gloves if you have some), or you can try to rest it close while you turn it over.
 
no spark !! (23/31)
 10/26/08 10:56pm
acplus
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I don't think you have the tach wire connected, if you do disconnect it,
 
Also when the coil or distributor cap is replaced, check that the ground clip is transferred from the old distributor cap to the new one. Remember there are two designs of HEI coils. One uses red and white wires, whereas the other design uses red and yellow wires for the primary coil that are reverse polarity be sure to get the proper one  in the proper spot.
no spark !! (24/31)
 10/26/08 11:16pm
acplus
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When you put the coil in ....you did put the spring loaded button on the bottom that touches the rotor right? If you can maybe take the coil out take it back where you bought it and have them test it and take your old one with you and have them test it too....if the old one is good this will help/seperate to find the problem.
John
no spark !! (25/31)
 10/28/08 7:20pm
vettemojo87
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YEEEE HAWWWWBig%20smile!!!
Problem found.  I was reading through all the posts & figured I'd run through all the tests again.  When I went to test the tach cord, I didn't like the results I was getting, according to Kstyer's post.  So, I disconnected the tach clip from the distrib & tried to start.  To my surprise, she fired right up!!!!  Yee HawBig%20smile!!!  You all deserve a big round of applauseClap.  You are all ok Thumbs%20Up in my book.  Thanks to everyone for helpping solve this problem.  If any of us ever meet up, first couple rounds are on me.
 
Now  I just have to find where the tach cord is not grounding properlyUnhappy.  But at least I know where the problem is & where to start. 
no spark !! (26/31)
 10/28/08 7:34pm
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That brown tach wire goes to a tach filter (or should) and then on into the dash and directly to the tach.   
 
If the tach filter is shorted it could prevent the car from starting.  You can bypass the filter for testing, and it may operate fine, but the tach could be erratic with the filter bypassed.
no spark !! (27/31)
 10/28/08 8:56pm
acplus
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Good going..... glad hear..now you can start another question thread for your tach wire problem.
John
no spark !! (28/31)
 10/29/08 5:35pm
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I've said it before but is worth repeating. This is the greatest site and group of people anywhere to troubleshoot problems. It is the reason that I am a LIFER. What a wonderful group of friends.

Scott
ranger32008-10-29 14:37:09
no spark !! (29/31)
 10/29/08 5:53pm
acplus
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Scott, you said it.
John
no spark !! (30/31)
 10/30/08 9:34am
vettemojo87
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I agree.
 
Brian
Re: no spark !! (31/31)
 11/30/17 12:06am
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I had the same problem with my 1981 350 L81, no spark and would not run. It had previously died randomly and then finally would not start at all. During the process of returning the car to service after 33 years in storage, a new ignition coil was installed in the HEI ignition. There are two grounds on the coil, one on top of the coil where the black wire attaches and the other is on the bottom of the coil where it grounds to the car. The new coil had a thick paint coating on the metal plates which was not removed in the two ground lug areas. Once the paint was removed in the ground lug areas, the car started and ran fine. What I think was happening was the ground lugs had just enough of a ground in the painted areas to let the car run intermittenly but would occasionally loose the ground and the car would just quit. Changing the module, radio supressor capacitor, and rotor had no effect. But when the paint in the ground lug areas was cleaned off, it had a good ground and ran fine. I now have a sign on my work bench stating "Before you spend any money chasing electrical problems with new parts, make sure the battery is good and all grounds are good". I already knew that but did not follow that advice on this problem, hence the sign.




|UPDATED|11/29/2017 9:06:21 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
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