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1/30/17 4:14pm - Original Message: '74 4-speed install suggestions'
gelpilot Gold Member
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Broken Arrow, OK - USA

Vette(s):
1974 Red Metallic convertible, 350, 4-speed.

Joined: 3/3/2016
Posts: 8
I've successfully removed the Borg-Warner T-10 4-speed from my 74 (350 engine) and subbed it out to a local transmission shop for breakdown and repair. It was having issues with the 2nd gear synchro, so it seemed like a good idea to just rebuild the whole transmission. But it was more than a minor chore to get the transmission out.

I unhooked the driveshaft, parking brake pulley, support pads, speedo cable, etc. When I thought I would just drop the cross-member like I did on my old 63 Impala, I found the darn thing was very firmly welded in place. I wound up disassembling the Hurst shifter and linkage completely before I could wiggle the transmission up, sideways and back enough to get the input shaft out of the bell housing. And it took quite a few four-letter words at that! :-)

My question for the forum - What did I miss? Surely it shouldn't be that hard?

It seems like the tail of the tail of the transmission was too fat to go out (or back in) with the shifter and linkage assembled. Anyone have experience that can share?

Help!

George Lehmann
Broken Arrow, OK


____________________________________
George Lehmann
Broken Arrow, OK
74 Metallic Red Convertible




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1/30/17 9:04pm - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
73shark
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Overland Park, KS - USA

Vette(s):
1973 Orange Metallic Coupe (orig owner), L82, 4 spd (WR), PS, (A/C & PW (I installed from wrecked 73)), leather, AM/FM Stereo, ran with '65 FI unit earlier & will again some day.

Joined: 7/9/2003
Posts: 381
I think that short of pulling it out w/ the engine, what you did is the only way to get it out.

____________________________________

1973 L-82 4 spd

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1/30/17 9:44pm - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
gelpilot Gold Member
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Broken Arrow, OK - USA

Vette(s):
1974 Red Metallic convertible, 350, 4-speed.

Joined: 3/3/2016
Posts: 8
73shark said: I think that short of pulling it out w/ the engine, what you did is the only way to get it out.


</Sigh>
I was afraid that would be the answer. 

I guess what I'll do is get the new shifter (the old Hurst shifter was getting stuck in the reverse gate so I went all out and got a new shifter and install kit) all set up, then carefully remove the rods and the shifter itself leaving the shifter base plate. Then get the transmission wiggled back into place and re-install the shifter and rods.

If there's a next time, I'll just pull the engine...

Thx,



____________________________________
George Lehmann
Broken Arrow, OK
74 Metallic Red Convertible




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1/30/17 9:59pm - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
manchestershark Lifetime Member
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Equinunk, PA - USA

Vette(s):
1972 conv, 4-speed, 350, 200hp, numbers match, rally wheels, war bonnett yellow w/white top. good condition, nice driver.

Joined: 10/31/2007
Posts: 1895
I pulled mine from a 72' Took distributor out, took shifter out. It's a BEAR to pull shifter. All mounts and bolts. Took fan off water pump, block of wood under rear of oil pan with hydraulic jack, lowered engine enough to remove tranny bolts, and let tail shaft pass over crossmember. Turn tranny on it's side and slide it out. It can be done, I did it alone and on the floor of my garage. The welded crossmember is a real bear. Sounds easy, BUT when it's laying on your chest under the car, you can be glad it's out. I put in a new shifter and made my own guage to line up the shifter before hooking up the linkage. Do EVERYTHING one time. Bad news to have to do it over when something else fails. Don't forget the new pilot bearing, and use an old input shaft to line up the clutch. NEW CLUTCH, turn flywheel. Clean parts go back together easier, they're not slippery. Go slow and be patient! F.Y.I., bad words don't help!

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1/30/17 11:38pm - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
Vman73
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Gig Harbor, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1973 L82 4 Speed Coupe - Very original, well documented driver/survivor. 2016 Bend Regional NCRS Top Flight.

Joined: 10/2/2014
Posts: 357
gelpilot said: I've successfully removed the Borg-Warner T-10 4-speed from my 74 (350 engine) and subbed it out to a local transmission shop for breakdown and repair. It was having issues with the 2nd gear synchro, so it seemed like a good idea to just rebuild the whole transmission. But it was more than a minor chore to get the transmission out.

I unhooked the driveshaft, parking brake pulley, support pads, speedo cable, etc. When I thought I would just drop the cross-member like I did on my old 63 Impala, I found the darn thing was very firmly welded in place. I wound up disassembling the Hurst shifter and linkage completely before I could wiggle the transmission up, sideways and back enough to get the input shaft out of the bell housing. And it took quite a few four-letter words at that! :-)

My question for the forum - What did I miss? Surely it shouldn't be that hard?

It seems like the tail of the tail of the transmission was too fat to go out (or back in) with the shifter and linkage assembled. Anyone have experience that can share?

Help!

George Lehmann
Broken Arrow, OK



George, as others have commented, you did it right, it's a major pain in the a**, but short of pulling the motor it's about the only way to do it. Ironically the cross member on automatic cars is removalable, but not 4speed cars. I did mine about two years ago. Getting it out wasn't too bad because the old exhaust system was cut up in pieces and laying on the floor, that gave me a little more room. As my wife would say "put on your patience hat" when you go to put it back in, that's where I had most of my problems. Getting the engine, trans and the input shaft spline properly aligned and back together can be a real pain. Be very careful if you use the bolts from the trans to the bell housing to "pull" things back together. If not aligned properly it's a great way to break off the aluminum eyelets on the trans case. If the trans won't seat to the bell housing properly don't force it, slide it back out and try again. By the way, don't bother with a tranny jack, it's useless under there with the crossmember in the way. Good luck and welcome to C3VR !!

____________________________________
John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
NCRS Member 61302
NW NCRS Chapter Member



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1/31/17 1:17am - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
gelpilot Gold Member
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Broken Arrow, OK - USA

Vette(s):
1974 Red Metallic convertible, 350, 4-speed.

Joined: 3/3/2016
Posts: 8
John, Manchester, etal,
I do have a new clutch, pilot bearing, etc. I should get the tranny back tomorrow and begin reassembly. Have to disagree on the 4-letter words.  A swear once in a while at least makes Me feel better. :-)

Thanks for the comments, I'll report back when it's done.



____________________________________
George Lehmann
Broken Arrow, OK
74 Metallic Red Convertible




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1/31/17 10:34am - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
DarinM
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Caddo Mills, TX - USA

Vette(s):
1980 Black on Black 4speed 383 Stroker 17x9 rear, 17x8 front with 255-50R-17 Nitto tires OBX Stainless Steel sidepipes DeWitts radiator with dual electric fans

Joined: 9/15/2015
Posts: 38
Not sure if it's an option for you to make the conversion, but on my 1980, the 4 speed crossmember is removable from the factory which made it a TON easier. I installed it along with the motor, but due to a throwout bearing install mistake, i had to pull it out afterwards from underneath. If my crossmember was not removable, i think i would have pulled the motor and tranny together vs. underneath just to save the frustration, cursing and all the nasty things that would go along with it. That transmission isn't all that heavy until you have to hold it for more than a few minutes !

Having the removable crossmember allowed me to only have to remove the shift lever from the mechanism to drop the transmission.


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4/28/17 11:53am - Reply: 'Re: 74 4-speed install suggestions'
gelpilot Gold Member
Gold Member
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Broken Arrow, OK - USA

Vette(s):
1974 Red Metallic convertible, 350, 4-speed.

Joined: 3/3/2016
Posts: 8
It's been several months and much has been going on with my 74, and I promised a reply when I finished up the transmission project. 

Putting the transmission back in wasn't nearly as difficult as I had been fearing. I took my time, got the new shifter all aligned while the transmission was on the bench, then carefully removed the linkage and the shifter from the transmission, leaving the shifter backplate on the transmission. I wiggled the rear of the transmission up on the crossmember with the transmission on its side (linkage arms down), and hooked an inch of the input shaft on the bell housing. I then rotated the transmission upright, got a transmission jack, and lifted it up to get perfect alignment for sliding into the clutch. Yes, I did put a new clutch in while I had everything apart. Smile I hate pilot bearings.

After that I got the transmission bolted in all around. Next the two bolts to connect the shifter to the backplate that was still bolted to the transmission. This is where the space was probably the tightest. There's about an inch clearance beside the shifter after its on, so the bolts have to be in the shifter and you just have to squeeze you hand and the some ratchet type box end wrenches in. Finally I put the linkage arms back on and tested the neutral alignment with the pin provided. Getting the shifter arm connected from the top was a bit of an effort - small space to put in two small bolts with large clumsy fingers, but I got it done. 

Filled it with fluid (important step!) and that project was finished. Brakes, rollbar, 5-point harness are separate stories.

Cheers,
George


____________________________________
George Lehmann
Broken Arrow, OK
74 Metallic Red Convertible




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