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1/3/18 6:17pm - Original Message: 'Shift to 2nd issue'
BillHanna
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Cana, VA - USA

Vette(s):
1975 Stingray

Joined: 7/3/2016
Posts: 99
When I shift to 2nd (either up-shift or downshift) I have to not hold the lever to the left or it will not go into gear.  I have gotten used to it by now, but I was wondering what suggestions you may have as to what the problem could be.  All the other gear shifts are tight.  I believe this is the stock shifter.
Is there an adjustment for this, or is maybe the shifter just worn out?
The is on my '75 coupe with manual 4-speed.


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1/7/18 12:29am - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
Vman73
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Gig Harbor, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1973 L82 4 Speed Coupe - Very original, well documented driver/survivor. 2016 Bend Regional NCRS Top Flight.

Joined: 10/2/2014
Posts: 381
Bill, surprised you havenít got a reply from Joel (Adams Apple) on this one, heís our transmission expert. Iíll take my best shot at it. Since you mention that it seems to be a left/right issue, Iíll say it is the shifter. Probably worn out where the lever engages the cams in the shifter assembly. If your problem was back/forth or popping out of gear, I would suggest adjustment of the shifting rods, this sounds like the shifter itself. The bottom of the lever pivots left and right to engage either the R, 1st-2nd or 3rd-4th cams. If the pivot, the 1st-2nd cam or the bottom of the lever are worn out they could be the cause of your problem. I know of no adjustment that might help the side to side issue other than complete rebuild of the shifter. Check out rebuild kits from some of the Corvette vendors and youíll see the parts/pieces involved. Rebuilding the shifter once out of the car is pretty straightforward, getting it out of the car and back it will test your patience to new levels !! Letís see if anyone else has any other ideas before digging into a shifter R and R, itís not pretty !!

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John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
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1/7/18 10:18am - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
BillHanna
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Cana, VA - USA

Vette(s):
1975 Stingray

Joined: 7/3/2016
Posts: 99
Vman73 said: Bill, surprised you havenít got a reply from Joel (Adams Apple) on this one, heís our transmission expert. Iíll take my best shot at it. Since you mention that it seems to be a left/right issue, Iíll say it is the shifter. Probably worn out where the lever engages the cams in the shifter assembly. If your problem was back/forth or popping out of gear, I would suggest adjustment of the shifting rods, this sounds like the shifter itself. The bottom of the lever pivots left and right to engage either the R, 1st-2nd or 3rd-4th cams. If the pivot, the 1st-2nd cam or the bottom of the lever are worn out they could be the cause of your problem. I know of no adjustment that might help the side to side issue other than complete rebuild of the shifter. Check out rebuild kits from some of the Corvette vendors and youíll see the parts/pieces involved. Rebuilding the shifter once out of the car is pretty straightforward, getting it out of the car and back it will test your patience to new levels !! Letís see if anyone else has any other ideas before digging into a shifter R and R, itís not pretty !!


Actually, it does jump out of 2nd gear sometimes when decelerating.  I had assumed that is internal to the transmission and not related to the shifter, but I guess it could be related.
I'm in the middle of painting the car now (I'll post pictures when it is done -- it is quite a wild. 60's kinda' look), but someday I plan on pulling the transmission and looking into that issue.


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1/7/18 12:05pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
Adams' Apple Lifetime Member
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Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 19496
BillHanna said: When I shift to 2nd (either up-shift or downshift) I have to not hold the lever to the left or it will not go into gear.  I have gotten used to it by now, but I was wondering what suggestions you may have as to what the problem could be.  All the other gear shifts are tight.  I believe this is the stock shifter.
Is there an adjustment for this, or is maybe the shifter just worn out?
The is on my '75 coupe with manual 4-speed.

You lost me there....not sure edzachary what you mean. The 1-2 shift would normally require you to hold the lever to the left slightly while moving the shifter down into 2nd. If you are in fact saying that doing it "normally" will keep it from going into 2nd, then I would have to agree there is an issue with the shifter being worn, or sticky. A rebuild kit will replace the spring shims, and a few other small parts that should tighten it up, but will not address worn holes in the levers themselves.
Jumping out of gear either on acceleration, or on deceleration indicates the trans either has too much internal endplay(forward/rearward), or the synchronizer teeth on the speed gear are worn, as well as the teeth on the synchro slider/hub. Either of these issues would require removal of the trans to replace any worn/damaged parts.
And I'll agree aboot getting the shifter out by itself....not a pretty thing to have to do, but it will(eventually) find it's way out. 







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1/7/18 3:32pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
Vman73
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Gig Harbor, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1973 L82 4 Speed Coupe - Very original, well documented driver/survivor. 2016 Bend Regional NCRS Top Flight.

Joined: 10/2/2014
Posts: 381
Bill, sounds like youíve got a great candidate for a trans rebuild, shifter rebuild and perhaps the removable cross member conversion Iíve read about in another post. Once the trans is out the shifter is still a bit of a challenge to R&R but MUCH easier than with the trans in. Youíll also get to appreciate all of the tight spaces working in and around the trans. Good luck if you decide to go there. I had my trans rebuilt two years ago. Everything seemed to be working okay but I had the engine out for a rebuild so perfect time to attack the trans. One opened up, the main bearing on the input shaft was pretty bad and the snycros were paper thin. All of the gears were in great shape, definitely worth the work !! It will also give you the opportunity to give the clutch a good going over.

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John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
NCRS Member 61302
NW NCRS Chapter Member



Duct tape is the new Black !!
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1/7/18 4:21pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
BillHanna
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Cana, VA - USA

Vette(s):
1975 Stingray

Joined: 7/3/2016
Posts: 99
Adams' Apple said:
BillHanna said: When I shift to 2nd (either up-shift or downshift) I have to not hold the lever to the left or it will not go into gear.  I have gotten used to it by now, but I was wondering what suggestions you may have as to what the problem could be.  All the other gear shifts are tight.  I believe this is the stock shifter.
Is there an adjustment for this, or is maybe the shifter just worn out?
The is on my '75 coupe with manual 4-speed.

You lost me there....not sure edzachary what you mean. The 1-2 shift would normally require you to hold the lever to the left slightly while moving the shifter down into 2nd. If you are in fact saying that doing it "normally" will keep it from going into 2nd, then I would have to agree there is an issue with the shifter being worn, or sticky. A rebuild kit will replace the spring shims, and a few other small parts that should tighten it up, but will not address worn holes in the levers themselves.
Jumping out of gear either on acceleration, or on deceleration indicates the trans either has too much internal endplay(forward/rearward), or the synchronizer teeth on the speed gear are worn, as well as the teeth on the synchro slider/hub. Either of these issues would require removal of the trans to replace any worn/damaged parts.
And I'll agree aboot getting the shifter out by itself....not a pretty thing to have to do, but it will(eventually) find it's way out. 






Normally you should be able to hold the shift lever all the way to the left going to 2nd but this hangs up on something, so I when I pull it back I have to keep it a bit off of the left guide.
At some point, I do plan on pulling the transmission and will address the shifter at that point.  I'd love to put in a Hurst shifter, but at over $1000.00 that can't be in the plans. . . (Last time I bought one it was less than $100.00, but then that was 50 years ago.)
Thanks for you input.





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1/7/18 5:09pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
Vman73
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Gig Harbor, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1973 L82 4 Speed Coupe - Very original, well documented driver/survivor. 2016 Bend Regional NCRS Top Flight.

Joined: 10/2/2014
Posts: 381
Bill, reading your latest response gave me another thought. If you problem is going into second, pulling to the left the shift lever is also trying to go over and into R. The lock out rod on the shifter is what keeps you from going there. Perhaps your lock out rod is getting worn off at the tip allowing you to partially engage the R cam as you pull back. That is an easy one to check. Unscrew your shift knob, remove the spring and the T handle with the lock out rod attached and check out the end of the rod. I once fixed a 75-77 4 speed car that allowed the owner to go into reverse without lifting the lock out. Pulled the rod and it was badly worn, replace the T handle and rod assembly and everything was good to go. A new T handle and rod assembly are available and pretty reasonable, just make sure you get the right length for your car. There was a switch in the length of the rod sometime in the mid to late 70ís, donít remember if it got longer or shorter but it changed. Certainly worth a look !!

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John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
NCRS Member 61302
NW NCRS Chapter Member



Duct tape is the new Black !!
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1/7/18 5:22pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
BillHanna
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Cana, VA - USA

Vette(s):
1975 Stingray

Joined: 7/3/2016
Posts: 99
Vman73 said: Bill, reading your latest response gave me another thought. If you problem is going into second, pulling to the left the shift lever is also trying to go over and into R. The lock out rod on the shifter is what keeps you from going there. Perhaps your lock out rod is getting worn off at the tip allowing you to partially engage the R cam as you pull back. That is an easy one to check. Unscrew your shift knob, remove the spring and the T handle with the lock out rod attached and check out the end of the rod. I once fixed a 75-77 4 speed car that allowed the owner to go into reverse without lifting the lock out. Pulled the rod and it was badly worn, replace the T handle and rod assembly and everything was good to go. A new T handle and rod assembly are available and pretty reasonable, just make sure you get the right length for your car. There was a switch in the length of the rod sometime in the mid to late 70ís, donít remember if it got longer or shorter but it changed. Certainly worth a look !!


Sounds like a good possibility.  I'll check that out soon as I can, but right now the car is all taped up for painting.  I can push it left going into 1st without a problem, wouldn't that also be a problem with a worn reverse lock-out?
Thanks!



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1/8/18 3:14pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
Vman73
Standard Member
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Gig Harbor, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1973 L82 4 Speed Coupe - Very original, well documented driver/survivor. 2016 Bend Regional NCRS Top Flight.

Joined: 10/2/2014
Posts: 381
Bill, going into first could also be a problem but most of the wear and tear comes from shifting aggressively from first to second. The tip of the lock out rod may by worn funny in that direction but in pretty good shape going the other direction. Let us know what you find when youíre able to get at it. I certainly would like to find you a cheap and easy fix for once !!

|UPDATED|1/8/2018 12:14:01 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


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John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
NCRS Member 61302
NW NCRS Chapter Member



Duct tape is the new Black !!
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1/12/18 1:34pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
persico Gold Member
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Long Valley, NJ - USA

Vette(s):
1972 454 Coupe, 4 speed, Targa Blue with blue interior, luggage rack

Joined: 3/21/2007
Posts: 258
In the spirit of the simplest explanation is usually the right one:  I had a problem with my shifter getting into gear and sometimes popping out.  I got in the car on the lift while my mechanic watched from underneath while I shifted through the gears.  We found the PO had routed the speedometer cable in such a way that it intefered with the shift levers.  Re-routed the cable and viola!  Problem solved.  Just sayin'!

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Mario
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1/14/18 2:04pm - Reply: 'Re: Shift to 2nd issue'
BillHanna
Standard Member
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Cana, VA - USA

Vette(s):
1975 Stingray

Joined: 7/3/2016
Posts: 99
Vman73 said: Bill, reading your latest response gave me another thought. If you problem is going into second, pulling to the left the shift lever is also trying to go over and into R. The lock out rod on the shifter is what keeps you from going there. Perhaps your lock out rod is getting worn off at the tip allowing you to partially engage the R cam as you pull back. That is an easy one to check. Unscrew your shift knob, remove the spring and the T handle with the lock out rod attached and check out the end of the rod. I once fixed a 75-77 4 speed car that allowed the owner to go into reverse without lifting the lock out. Pulled the rod and it was badly worn, replace the T handle and rod assembly and everything was good to go. A new T handle and rod assembly are available and pretty reasonable, just make sure you get the right length for your car. There was a switch in the length of the rod sometime in the mid to late 70ís, donít remember if it got longer or shorter but it changed. Certainly worth a look !!

The lock out rod is worn about 1/3 on one side.  I'll get a new one and see if that helps.
Thanks!



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