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7/31/13 10:39am - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
Former Member
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
rraider1 said: Something is really Weird here
 
The 12VDC that is at the courtesy lights, is also joined at a splice point with the Dome Lt, Cig Lighter and Clock.
If only the 2 courtesy lights do not have power, and the others work, the wires would have to be broken somewhere.
The Dome light and courtesy lights are joined at a splice point that can get a ground from the door SWS or from the headlight switch turned fully CCW.
 
If the power is good to the courtesy lights and the dome light is working it would have to be broken wires from the light sockets to the splice point
 
if turning the head light sw CCW and it causes an unusual load as seen on the amp meter (the dome light would come on) then something at the headlight switch must be wrong because opening the doors would do the same thing because that is the ground circuit.
 
If their is a delay timer it is installed into the circuit just prior to the door switches. if I have traced it wright it should be like this
 
 







Thank you for this diagram. It does clarify some things for me. I have to wonder if there's a chance the clock may come back to life once the grounding issue is solved. Is that possible?
 
I seriously doubt if there is a delay timer. The prior owner was much more likely to take things out than to put them in (he removed the AC compressor... wish I had it as it could be rebuilt) and I don't think a '72 came standard with the timer.
 
How does the headlight switch ground? Is there a ground wire from that switch to the frame?
 
Does the dome light/convertible rear compartment light operate off of a separate switch? (There is one at the rear of the driver's door.)



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7/31/13 12:33pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
rraider1
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Woodland, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1977 T-Top,350,Auto Black Ruby Pearl,Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 10/14/2003
Posts: 1152
you may still have problems with the door switches, but keep in mind that when the headlight sw is turned CCW it puts a ground to the white wires. the door switches are not used at that point.
 
Keep it simple use light sw ground or pick one door sw using you meter check the wht wire for continuity from bulb socket to wire at switch. if you have continuity then its the sw or the grounding of the sw. 
 
 
if their was/or is a timer it is added to the circuit in between splice point and the door sws if it is bad or has been removed it would keep the door switches from working.
 
Does anybody know if 72's had a delay timer?
 
  


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Bob R
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7/31/13 1:34pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
Adams' Apple Lifetime Member
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Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 19448
The delay timer wasn't used until '77. Thumbs Up
My bet is the wire terminals AT the door pin switches are bad. The white wires have TINY terminals that fit thru a plastic insulator at the pin switch, and are then bent over. When the switch is closed(door open), the terminals make contact with the metal switch housing, creating the ground for the lights. Those tiny, bent terminals fall off over time. Sometimes, the wire will fall off, too, but most of the time, the terminals stay put, and LOOK like they are good. The only real way to check is to unscrew the switch and have a look-see. You can ohm the wires from the socket to the pin switches, and they will most likely check out fine, since grounding the dangly wire lights up the one bulb on the other side of the car...that tells me the wiring itself is prolly otay. If you ohm from the white wire to the chassis(or battery) with the door open, I bet you find there is no continuity...
I have made terminals for these switches before out of other flat bladed terminals, so they can be fixed if yours are messed up. The one on my driver side on the '74 was, but it ain't no mo. Wink
(btw....this is a replacement switch, and not made exactly like the originals)



And Rich...if ya snooze, ya looze! LOL Tongue

|UPDATED|7/31/2013 10:34:33 AM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


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Joel Adams
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7/31/13 1:59pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
Former Member
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
Adams' Apple said: The delay timer wasn't used until '77. Thumbs Up
My bet is the wire terminals AT the door pin switches are bad. The white wires have TINY terminals that fit thru a plastic insulator at the pin switch, and are then bent over. When the switch is closed(door open), the terminals make contact with the metal switch housing, creating the ground for the lights. Those tiny, bent terminals fall off over time. Sometimes, the wire will fall off, too, but most of the time, the terminals stay put, and LOOK like they are good. The only real way to check is to unscrew the switch and have a look-see. You can ohm the wires from the socket to the pin switches, and they will most likely check out fine, since grounding the dangly wire lights up the one bulb on the other side of the car...that tells me the wiring itself is prolly otay. If you ohm from the white wire to the chassis(or battery) with the door open, I bet you find there is no continuity...
I have made terminals for these switches before out of other flat bladed terminals, so they can be fixed if yours are messed up. The one on my driver side on the '74 was, but it ain't no mo. Wink
(btw....this is a replacement switch, and not made exactly like the originals)



And Rich...if ya snooze, ya looze! LOL Tongue




So this is why when I run a ground wire to the switch housing nothing happens. There is a break (probably) AT the switch and probably having to do with those nasty little terminals. Smile

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7/31/13 2:31pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
Adams' Apple Lifetime Member
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Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 19448
By Jove, I think you've GOT IT! LOL
Yeah...that's what Imma thinkin is the problem...you've pretty well checked everything else, and it all seems to be in good shape. Being able to ground the dangly wire and have lights is the key. Even so, the courtesy lights should come on when you twist the headlight switch all the way....that might be a different issue with the headlight switch itself, but...one problem at a time...Thumbs Up
Hang in there....we'll git ya lit up like a Christmas tree a'fore ya know it! Wink


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Joel Adams
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             NCRS

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7/31/13 2:57pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
Well, tonight will be the CCW test of the light switch. Turns out one of the courtesy light sockets was empty, another corroded and the one in the back had the wrong bulb installed! So it's not much wonder that they didn't come on. Big smile
 
Now I've got one working for sure and I'll get the correct bulb for the back end tonight. Somehow I think the light at the end of the tunnel is not a train.
 
The front socket had the right light installed but it was so badly corroded I couldn't get the light out without breaking it. Even with it broken I can't get the remainder of the light out! That's why I snipped it off. That one will be replaced.
 
I hope I'm not too much of a bother for you and the others. You all seem to be taking a bit of humorous joy watching my struggles. I suspect you find it fun especially given that you don't have to do the work and skin the knuckles! LOL


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7/31/13 3:14pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
F4Gary Gold Member
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Grapevine, TX - USA

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1972 LT-1 convertible with factory air.

Joined: 8/26/2006
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I had to replace the door switches in my 72 convertible.  Lights worked properly after that.  No delay timer on my car.

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7/31/13 3:16pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
rraider1
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Woodland, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1977 T-Top,350,Auto Black Ruby Pearl,Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 10/14/2003
Posts: 1152
Hey for me this is fun. I think its more fun helping you than if I had to do it on mine. only my fingers are getting tired my back and old bones are not whining at meThumbs UpClap

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Bob R
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7/31/13 4:00pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
Former Member
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
rraider1 said: Hey for me this is fun. I think its more fun helping you than if I had to do it on mine. only my fingers are getting tired my back and old bones are not whining at meThumbs UpClap

You know you're not far from me. We gotta meet up somewhere soon. Aren't you pretty close to the Chateau St. Michelle winery? A bunch of us BSU Bronco fans make the trek over there once in a while because the winemaker is one of us. Smile
 
We also head over to the Walla Walla area just about every year to replentish our wine cellars. Geek
 
Anyway, my '72 is about six months shy of being pretty presentable. It's able to travel now but if it rains I'm gonna get wet. No weather strip that works and the window header is a rusty shadow of its former self. But by next spring all of that will change!



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7/31/13 4:07pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
Adams' Apple Lifetime Member
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Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 19448
dbarnesid said:I hope I'm not too much of a bother for you and the others. You all seem to be taking a bit of humorous joy watching my struggles. I suspect you find it fun especially given that you don't have to do the work and skin the knuckles! LOL


Dave, we're not making fun of ya or anything like that. But...I do have a little chuckle knowing it's someone ELSE goin thru it. Trust me...we've ALL been where you are at some point, and we've all got the scars(physical and metal) to prove it! It's like a Classic Corvette rite of passage....everyone must do it.
We enjoy helping others thru issue like this...it's why we're here. We kid around, and have fun, but in the end, it's all about helping others. If we can help get and keep another Classic Shark on the road, it's all good! Hug


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Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    
My Link


(click for Texas-sized view!)
             NCRS

"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"
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7/31/13 4:54pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
Former Member
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
Adams' Apple said:
dbarnesid said:I hope I'm not too much of a bother for you and the others. You all seem to be taking a bit of humorous joy watching my struggles. I suspect you find it fun especially given that you don't have to do the work and skin the knuckles! LOL


Dave, we're not making fun of ya or anything like that. But...I do have a little chuckle knowing it's someone ELSE goin thru it. Trust me...we've ALL been where you are at some point, and we've all got the scars(physical and metal) to prove it! It's like a Classic Corvette rite of passage....everyone must do it.
We enjoy helping others thru issue like this...it's why we're here. We kid around, and have fun, but in the end, it's all about helping others. If we can help get and keep another Classic Shark on the road, it's all good! Hug

Thanks, Joel.
 
Sometimes I can't wait to work on this old heap and sometimes I want to drive it off a cliff... with me in it! Put us BOTH out of our misery.
 
I just look forward to being able to jump in and help another struggling neophyte. I guess I have... since I've learned more than a thing or two about interior installation. The good and the bad. I must say, I got a compliment from a body man about my interior. He wanted to know where I had it done because it's one of the best he's seen. I did it myself. Embarrassed So I did offer some advice the other day. (Don't use the supplied clips to secure the springs to the cover. Build your own clips using hog rings. It's faster, stronger, and it flexes that way.)
 
I just don't want to be a pest or impose myself on you guys. As long as I don't do that all is good. And I must admit that I very much enjoy my new community of enthusiasts.



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7/31/13 11:13pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
Former Member
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
Minor Victory I twist the light switch CCW and the passenger side courtesy light goes on! More wins are sure to follow. Thanks gang!

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8/1/13 12:55pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
rraider1
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Woodland, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1977 T-Top,350,Auto Black Ruby Pearl,Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 10/14/2003
Posts: 1152
use that to fix the other lights once you have all the lights working then tackle the door switchesWacko

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Bob R
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8/3/13 6:26pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
dbarnesid
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Boise, ID - USA

Vette(s):
1972 mille miglia red corvette convertible. This is a car currently under restoration. The pic above is of me and my Ph.D. candidate daughter. She, not my Vette, is my pride and joy. Smile...

Joined: 5/29/2013
Posts: 159
Thank you gentlemen! The lights are fixed except for the door ajar warning on the drivers side. Passenger side works. All interior lights work. Clock? No. :( I actually fixed the switches. They needed some wire brush and TC-11 treatment. Cleaned out the holes in the bird cage. WHT terminal needed to be pushed toward the switch just about 1/32. Pass side was just dirty. Needed reconditioning. Bubba had wrong bulb in dome light (1 terminal not 2). Anyway. You all helped me learn how the system works. Once it made sense to me the fix was easy. And, of course, I fixed the switches two days after ordering new ones from Zips.

|UPDATED|8/3/2013 3:26:10 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


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8/3/13 11:00pm - Reply: 'Re: Another interior light question.'
rraider1
Former Member
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Woodland, WA - USA

Vette(s):
1977 T-Top,350,Auto Black Ruby Pearl,Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 10/14/2003
Posts: 1152
Thumbs UpClapGeek

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Bob R
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