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7/18/12 3:50pm - Original Message: 'Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
kwoody
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Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Hello all.

I'm getting a little concerned about the use of E10 in my car.  I live in the desert and some of you may know
that this time of year is our monsoon season.  Some time ago, I installed an ACDelco '85 higher pressure and volume fuel pump to my '82.  Everything is working fine and I'm very happy with the performance.  I'm also a pilot and have been reading about the use of Auto gas in normally aspirated aircraft engines.  Most folks do not use auto fuel in their certificated airplanes but, the experimental aircraft owners have embraced it's use.  The problem seems to be the absorption of water by the E10 then the alcohol boils off as the temperature spikes while the aircraft sits on the tarmac leaving water to sink to the bottom of the fuel tank.  Water is a real killer in aircraft fuel systems.

Normally, we drain the low points in the fuel systems of aircraft during the preflight inspection.  Not a solution in my garage. I have noticed a gurgling sound coming from my tank on more than one occasion.  It really gets hot in parking lots and I have noticed a great deal of venting when I remove the gas cap....  The temp in the garage rarely gets over 120* in the garage but, if I've been on a drive and parked in an open parking spot the pavement provides a lot of heat to the tank.  I've seen asphalt temps in excess of 180* at the airport and that is before we started paving.

Any thoughts?

Thanks
Keith


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7/18/12 7:22pm - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
tb2k82ce Lifetime Member
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Lemon Grove, CA - USA

Vette(s):
1982 C3 Collectors Edition 44000 miles, sat in the sun most of it's life, My wife purchased it for me for fathers day in 2007 from her girl friend that had it for 19 years. It is on the road again. I'm retired but it is now my daily driver.

Joined: 10/17/2007
Posts: 2007
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Sorry I could not resist it.   

I'm thinking the only way to know is after a while run a hose into the bottom of the tank and suck some fluid out.  If it is mostly gas then you really do not have an issue.  

Everything else that is offered unless it is based on some test, is just going to be an opinion basically.  You already have mine Beer


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7/18/12 8:24pm - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
Sarge81 Lifetime Member
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WEST SENECA, NY - USA

Vette(s):
1981 Blue Ice Met. w/pearl ghost flames TKO500 5speed. LS1 Swap 3.45 Dana 44.

Joined: 12/3/2001
Posts: 2376
I don't think E10 is a big an issue with cars as it is with small engines for lawnmowers, chainsaws, etc.

One of my friends sampled some fuel from my area and found it actually had 15% Ethanol instead of the advertised 10%. I guess the shelf life is very short for E10. I know my vette has never run the same as it did before the E10/E15 stuff came out, but it never has disabled the car. I don't think the carburetor can compensate for the Ethanol like fuel injection can.

Our weather conditions vary from -10 degrees in the winter all the way up into the mid 90's during the summer with high humidity and I know of no one having issues with E10. The local small engine repair shops around here are plenty busy fixing lawnmowers, snowblowers, weed wackers, chainsaws, rototillers, and anything with a small engine due to the Ethanol in our fuel. I use "Ethanol Shield" from Home Depot for my yard equipment. I have no issues. My snowblower fires up every time in the fall, and the lawnmower and weed wacker fire up ok in the spring. 


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7/18/12 9:43pm - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
Adams' Apple Lifetime Member
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Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

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You might be surprised/shocked to find out what the actual ethanol content is in fuel these days. The Gov. is pressing to go to 15%....I think it's been over that for quite a while.
Not only do you have to worry aboot it absorbing moisture in YOUR tank, it also is absorbing moisture in the tanks at the gas station....so you're actually paying for some of the water...the rest is free.

Best thing is to get something like Sarge suggested to help break the water up, and run it thru the system, instead of just sitting in the bottom of the tank. On the older cars like my '74, you can look down in the tanks and see what's at the bottom. Later cars...not so much.
It's just gunna get worse, too, so all you can do is put something in with it to help, and drive it as much as you can.(says the guy that never drives either of his...)

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7/19/12 6:51am - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
VikingVette
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Greer, SC - USA

Vette(s):
1978 Black with Viking mural painted under hood AM/FM/CB radio, T-top and a 2013 Cyber Gray Grand Sport Coupe, 2LT for my daily driver

Joined: 3/13/2012
Posts: 264
I do not know how they get around it, but here in Greenville, SC, there are a few stations that sell PURE gasoine (NO ETHANOL).  It is more expensive, but both my cars run better on it and I do get marginally better mileage.

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7/19/12 9:16am - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
kwoody
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Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Hello all.

Good considerations all.  Yesterday was a typical day here during the monsoon.  We had partly cloudy skys with temps hovering around 100*.  The garage was 115*.  Our hottest month is normally June.  Although, the average temps keep moving up until mid Sept, it just gets warmer at night.  We may have a few more 105* plus days but, the worst part of the heat is past.

I'm told by the locals that the alcohol/gas mix changes twice a year here.  I really have not notices any change in performance though.  I'll have Baby out for a 40 mile romp today.  The lowest regular price I've seen lately is $3.23 for cash. I don't have any hesitation or drop in power during acceleration that you might expect with water getting to the the injectors.

Thanks for the responses.

Having fun in the desert.

Keith


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7/20/12 5:09am - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
manget1 Lifetime Member
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Indianapolis, IN - USA

Vette(s):
Silver 1974 Convertible - L82 4 speed Low miles (was only 8,900 when I bought it in March 2006) - Now 42K miles. Original owner bought it as an investment for son's college expenses. 2008 Jetstream Blue Convertible - DAILY DRIVER!!

Joined: 9/3/2006
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tb2k82ce said: Move Thumbs Up

Sorry I could not resist it.   


Not sure where you think he can go.  I live in Indy and we have had multiple days (I beleive the most in history) in the triple digits this year.  Last night, the news reported that the month of May was the warmest ever recorded in North America.

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7/20/12 11:07am - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
corvette440hp Lifetime Member
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Alcohol absorbing water in my tank? Isn't that like going to a bar and filling your gut with alcohol..................ebo made me say that!Wink

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7/20/12 6:33pm - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
73shark
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Overland Park, KS - USA

Vette(s):
1973 Orange Metallic Coupe (orig owner), L82, 4 spd (WR), PS, (A/C & PW (I installed from wrecked 73)), leather, AM/FM Stereo, ran with '65 FI unit earlier & will again some day.

Joined: 7/9/2003
Posts: 394
Stabil makes a fuel treatment for E10 gas.  Most of the places that I've found that still sell pure gas do so only on 91 octane.

All of my small engines now run like crap.  Going to switch to pure gas.




|UPDATED|7/20/2012 4:33:35 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


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7/20/12 8:37pm - Reply: 'Re: Alcohol absorbing water in my tank?'
kwoody
Former Member
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Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Thanks all.

We get some gully washers here.  It does not rain much but, when it does rain there is a lot of local
flooding.  I flew yesterday and of the folks I talked to at the airport only one had found water in his tanks.
I suspect a leaky gas cap on his high wing Cessna. They are vented to prevent  fuel starvation

Again, the monsoon will pass. 

I lived on the coast up in New England so, the problem of water in the fuel was much more of an issue. I always found it in my lawn tractor/snow plow.  It was easy enough to drain the tank.

Thanks for all the inputs.

Keith


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Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
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