C3 Vette Registry - The Best Resource on the Net for C3 Vettes! C3 Vette
Forums -> C3 Handling Components
Not Logged In! Login or Register!  Users Online: 20 / Help 
Features  Find C3 Parts on ebay in only 2 or 3 clicks!  | Add YOUR C3 to the Registry

Supporting Vendors
VetteBookStore.com
Bair's Corvettes
Mid America Motorworks
Volunteer Vette Products
CorvetteClothing.com

C3 of the Month
None Current
Enter Yours Today!
Online C3 Show
13
C3s are Registered

Vanity Plates
4 SPDBB
73 LS-4
Featured Links

Buy Now
How To Rebuild Corvette Rolling Chassis 1963-1982
How To Rebuild Corvette Rolling Chassis 1963-1982


Chevrolet Corvette Restoration Guide
Chevrolet Corvette Restoration Guide


Chevrolet Corvette: 1968 thru 1982, All V8 models (Haynes Manuals) (Paperback)
Chevrolet Corvette: 1968 thru 1982, All V8 models (Haynes Manuals) (Paperback)


Corvette Magazine - $19.99 for 8 issues
Corvette Magazine
Only $19.99 for 8 issues



| Hide Signatures and Profile Pics

 New Topic New Topic Post Reply Reply New Poll New Poll Search     Search Page [1] 2  
12/17/11 1:20pm - Original Message: 'Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Hello All.

Well, I have been looking forward to this project.  I have most all the tools I think I'll need.  (That statement is almost always followed to a trip to Harbor Freight.)  The garage is built and lighted. A reasonably nice and warm day in the desert for December  68*.  It is my first brake job and also the first brake job for my Baby 82. 

I have read most everything I can find on the subject and have the correct parts and replacement flex lines ready to install.  I went with ACDelco and locally available flexible replacement lines.  While I'm doing the front breaks I'm also replacing the bearings and seal.  That is also a first time thing for me.

I have the wheels off and the hub off the axle and have proceeded to drill out the rivets that were factory installed to hold the rotor on the hub.  The heads have drilled off pretty much on both sides. The problem is the rivets won't come out.  I have resisted banging directly on them with a hammer.  I don't have a grinding wheel but, think that may be my only choice.  First I have been soaking these and the other wheel rivets for the past few days.  Still, nothing budging. I am next going to drill all the way through the rivets with a small drill bit.  That may allow some give after the heating of the drilling process.   

Any other ideas?   Thanks,

Keith

Fun in the Sun...




____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
 
Support C3VR!
Suport our advertisers
12/17/11 2:51pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Ok...

The drilling and enlarging the hole in the rivets worked pretty well.  I can see where this would be a lot easier with a drill press.  I kept going up to a larger bit until about 80% of the rivet was drilled out.  Then I was able to loosen the rivet and remove it using a punch and hammer.  Unfortunately,  I was off center on a couple of the rivets so the drilling went into the hub as well.   It is not pretty but,  the passenger side will go a little smoother knowing what I know now.

This would have not gone this well if I tried to do this with the hub still on the axle.

Still having fun...

Keith



|UPDATED|12/17/2011 12:51:43 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/17/11 3:46pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
yostusota
Former Member
- Send Private Message


York, PA - USA

Vette(s):
1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top

Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
Sounds like this job is going easy for you..were you planning on doing anything with the calipers?? Glad that the garage is getting broken in.

____________________________________

My first parade at Carlisle 2010
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/17/11 5:45pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
crossfire1982
Standard Member
- Send Private Message


Cramerton, NC - USA

Vette(s):
black 1982 coupe slate gray interior, 350 crossfire, 1985 fuel pump, Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 8/22/2006
Posts: 1094
Sounds like you are making good progress.  Thumbs Up

____________________________________

Click for a larger image
Save The Wave


 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/17/11 6:52pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
Adams' Apple Lifetime Member
Lifetime Member
Moderator
- Send Private Message


Duncanville, TX - USA

Vette(s):
#1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas

Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 19457
Unless you are replacing the rotors, there's really no need to remove them from the hubs. Saves you a ton of time by not having to mess with the rivets.
Also, when the rivets are "set", they swell into the holes, which is what makes them a little tough to get out. They are installed from the rear, and then a huge press mashes them flat. Once you drill the head off of the front side, the body of the rivet is still swedged in the hole. The thing to do is simply drill the heads enough until you can remove the rotor from the hub...and leave the rivet in place. Then, if you must, you can press the body of the rivet on thru the hub.


____________________________________
Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    
My Link


(click for Texas-sized view!)
             NCRS

"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/17/11 9:33pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Thanks for the info. 

   I am replacing both front rotors and both front calipers and the flex hoses and while I'm at it the inside and outside bearings and seal. I'm staying with DoT3 fluid and the master cylinder was replaced when I bought the car 8 years ago.  The driver's side caliper had one side frozen so one side of the rotor was almost gone.

   Today, I got the bearings, new rotor, caliper and line installed on the driver's side.  I have the passenger's side hub off but, have not drilled out the rivets.  That will be tomorrow's job, if I don't get called into work. I'll be a lot more concerned with getting the pilot holes drilled in the center of the rivets.  Once I got the pilot holes drilled all the way through the rivets stepping up the bit size went pretty well.  What was left was easily pounded in with a cold chisel and popped out with a pair of pliers.  I did pre loaded a little brake fluid in the calipers but, not enough to squirt out the flex line that I put on before installing the caliper. 

Oddly enough, the only repair I remember my dad doing was replacing a wheel bearing on an old Triumph station wagon he used on the flight line.  I vividly remember the grease in the palm and the motion of packing the bearings.  I never got to see him work on the old radial engines. He had stories of fixing B-29 engines. Those were big radial engines. 

So far.... so good.  Still having some fun.

Keith



|UPDATED|12/17/2011 7:33:45 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 3:09am - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
yostusota
Former Member
- Send Private Message


York, PA - USA

Vette(s):
1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top

Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
Love it!! Glad to hear you have memories of your dad like that..couldn't imagine working on a B-29!!..little more to go and you'll be stirring up that dust out there again!! Keep having fun.

____________________________________

My first parade at Carlisle 2010
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 8:36am - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
lukesvette Lifetime Member
Lifetime Member
- Send Private Message


HOWELL, NJ - USA

Vette(s):
1979, Targa Blue (72 Color), Pace Car rear spoiler, L88 hood, Dark blue factory interior, 525HP 406, HD 700R4, 370 gears,Steeroids, composite rear spring, TT IIs wrapped in T/A Radials.

Joined: 5/18/2004
Posts: 6806
I used an air chisel with a tapered punch bit on the shank of the rivet and walked them right out. Wink

|UPDATED|12/18/2011 6:36:06 AM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________
LukesVette Homepage
Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom
101st Airborne(AirAssault!)
God Bless America

Support Our Troops


     
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 11:27am - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Thanks Lukester. 

I have not added any air tools except the lugnut on/off driver.  I'll have to make one more trip to HF this year.  It is about 25 miles from here on the East side of town.  I'd really like an air driven jack.  The floor jack motion is just the movement that sets off my back troubles.

Yeah.  In early 1941 the army went to Spartanburg Airport and grabbed the two aircraft mechanics there. My dad was one of them.  He was too old for the draft.   They took them home and convinced them it was a good idea to join the military. They made him a 3 stripe SGT out of basic. Then he was sent to Casey Jones school of Aeronautics and pipe-lined as an instructor for two years.   He did not talk about this stuff until he retired from the Air Force with 30 years of service.

We'll see how the passenger side goes today.  It is very nice not to be rolling around on the desert floor. 

Trying to have fun in the sun...


Keith




____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 5:46pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
I forgot to mention.  After getting the rivets out and the old bearing sleves out.  I put the new bearing sleves in the freezer for a couple of hours and heated up the cleaned hub in my grill for 20 mins.  I could hear the sizzle on the wet rags as I carried it back to the garage.  Only took a few minutes to seat the sleves in the hubs.  This trick was worth the effort.

Being somewhat amused in the sun....and rain.


Keith



____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 5:58pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
yostusota
Former Member
- Send Private Message


York, PA - USA

Vette(s):
1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top

Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
That sounds like you're having fun with this...next thing you know you will be curing paint in the stove in the house!! Haven't used the heat freeze method in some time now..but it does work good..usually used the blue tipped wrench with an open flame on it..glad its going easy for you..have you thought of tweaking the runnout yet? That will be the final step and you'll be done! Love the stories about your dad..good Stuff!!

____________________________________

My first parade at Carlisle 2010
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 10:42pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Well, I don't have a micrometer but, I did set my vise under the wheel and put a stiff wire up to the rotor. The driver's side was just fine. No more than a piece of paper difference as it turned.  After the Pat's game I'll get the passenger side assembled and try that out. I made a point to clean off the rust and smooth out the surface on the hub. I used a wire brush attachment on my drill.  As long as it did not warp in the grill, it should be good. I've read about the soda can shims if I need to do that. The ACDelco store only had the upgrade rotors in-stock so, I am expecting things to be good.  The hub is the questionable part of the equation.  I think. I made sure to remove any burs sticking out where the rivets were removed.

The longer it rains here the less fun this project seems to be.  I hope to get a first bleed on the system tonight and finish in the AM. 


Keith

Additional:  The passenger side rotor did not show any detectable warble runout when turned.  If I understand what I'm looking for correctly...


|UPDATED|12/18/2011 8:42:17 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/18/11 10:35pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
It is dark:thirty now.   The passenger's side hub, rotor, caliper and flex hose are installed.  The odd thing for me was the wheel bearing did not want to go over the axle.  I brought it inside the house and held it between my hands and then tried it and it slipped right where it should be.  I'm glad that worked out because it was packed with grease.  Are they really that tight on the axle?  And that sensitive to heat?
I never had to do any press fitting working on electrics in the AF.  We did have oil lines going to the constant speed drives that were mated to the generators but, that was all 1/2" lines with compression fittings.

I did a few draws of brake fluid through the bleed valve with my vacuum pump and reservoir system.  There is plenty of air still in the system.  That is job 1 in the AM. 

Now if it all works after bleeding!  I did get a squirt of fluid out of the brake line while I was pulling the pads and compressing the pistons to fit the pads around the rotor.  At least it didn't hit me in the face.


Still somewhat amused in the desert....in the dark.


Keith



____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/19/11 7:50pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
No rain today but, the air is very damp with temps in the low 50*s.

My bleeding plan was pretty simple.  Hook up my vacuum pump and suck the brake fluid through the bleed valve on the caliper.   This one person operation has worked for just bleeding the brakes every 6 months or so.  I had the lines open to the front wheels for about a week.  The level in the master never got very low. 

Today, I did my normal set up. Hand vacuum pump with a reservoir bubble for the brake fluid to collect. Just kept getting air and brake fluid. I checked the flex to steel connection - ok. No other open lines.  I sucked several reservoir full replenishing the master front tank as I went.  So, I got out the larger setup for changing the fluid I have.  It has a much larger reservoir tank and hooks up to my compressor.  I pulled three full 16 ounce jars through the two front calipers.  I put the top back on the master and tried the pedal and it felt pretty firm. 

This is the first time I've had a brake line open but, seems like that is a lot to bleed through.  I don't have a second person until maybe tomorrow night. The car is still up on jacks but, that should not make a difference. 

Am I doing something wrong?  I'm going to pull some more through tonight b4 work.


It has been a pretty fun day today. 

Keith



____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/19/11 8:18pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
crossfire1982
Standard Member
- Send Private Message


Cramerton, NC - USA

Vette(s):
black 1982 coupe slate gray interior, 350 crossfire, 1985 fuel pump, Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 8/22/2006
Posts: 1094

Everybody has their favorite way to bleed brakes but when I had trouble bleeding mine after first having the calipers off I ordered a set of Russel Speed Bleeders and they work great. I have a pressure bleeder and even that didnt give the results I wanted. With the speed bleeders one person can bleed the brakes easily, just keep the master full. Just push the brake pedal, dont pump it up or slam it to the floor, just push it to the floor gently.  The let air and fluid out but wont let any air in.  On a vette it takes 6 instead of 4.
http://www.russellperformance.com/mc/speed/domestic.shtml






|UPDATED|12/19/2011 6:18:02 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

Click for a larger image
Save The Wave


 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/19/11 8:41pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
yostusota
Former Member
- Send Private Message


York, PA - USA

Vette(s):
1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top

Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
Sounds like you almost got it..if you a using a vacuum setup pulling fluid from the bleeder it may be pulling air thru the caliper seals..try the speed bleeders those things work good!! if you can't get help..but if you can just have someone pump them up the old way to get the last bit of air out..I put a regulator on my vacuum bleeder to knock down the pressure..that may help too...oh a regulator can be as little as a pair of vice grips on the air line!!




|UPDATED|12/19/2011 6:41:54 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

My first parade at Carlisle 2010
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/19/11 8:38pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
yostusota
Former Member
- Send Private Message


York, PA - USA

Vette(s):
1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top

Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
I use this at home..its a cheap tool I picked up from Matco if I remember right..12$ or so..you can make one though with a milk or water bottle and your vacuum bleeder hose..just put enough fluid in the bottom of the bottle so the hose end is submerged in brake fluid and pump away..kinda like a speed bleeder just makes for a cheap tool.

____________________________________

My first parade at Carlisle 2010
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/19/11 8:39pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Thanks Rich and Chip.  I'll look into the speed bleeders. They will open when the pedal is pressed. I guess they come with lines or something to catch the fluid.

 I may have had the bleeder valves too loose and sucking air there.  I have tried hi and low pressure but, I'll have help tomorrow afternoon.  I'm feeling pretty good having the parts all installed. 

I've got a few more things to do before getting her off the jacks.  The wheels need a good cleaning and there is mud stuck all around the steering components I want to clean off.  I also have to look at the vacuum container for leaks. This will be a good time to do that too.  The roads are pretty muddy of late.  I hate driving her in the muddy season.

Thanks

Keith



____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/20/11 7:39am - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
crossfire1982
Standard Member
- Send Private Message


Cramerton, NC - USA

Vette(s):
black 1982 coupe slate gray interior, 350 crossfire, 1985 fuel pump, Steeroids R&P conversion

Joined: 8/22/2006
Posts: 1094
Keith,  The speed bleeders have  special sealant on the threads which prevent them from sucking air around the threads when you use them.  Once installed, you loosen them about a half turn (they come with directions), this allows fluid to move past the seat of the bleeder, just like a regular bleeder but then the fluid encounters the one way valve which allows air and fluid to exit the bleeder into the catch bottle but when you let up on the brake pedal, it seals to prevent air from entering the bleeder.  I'm using a plastic soda bottle with a hole drilled through the cap and a piece of clear tubing which fits the bleeder nipple to catch the fluid. A short piece of bent welding rod around the neck of the bottle and a hook on the other end allows me to hang the catch bottle on any convenient spot to prevent it from spilling.  I've even bled 2 calipers at the same time with this setup.




|UPDATED|12/20/2011 5:39:39 AM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

Click for a larger image
Save The Wave


 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
12/23/11 8:35pm - Reply: 'Re: Rotors: 1st Brake Job Front'
kwoody
Former Member
- Send Private Message


Tucson, AZ - USA

Vette(s):
1982 Black/Tan Leather Build Code C09E Bronze TTop CrossFire Fuel Injection L83 85 Fuel Pump Auto Axle 2.72 Firestone Firehawk Indy500

Joined: 7/11/2010
Posts: 415
Well again thanks to everyone for your help.

After an interruption of 3 days of 12 hour shifts at the airport,  I got all the air out of the
new brakes and installed speed bleeders in the front to make sure all was well and make
the next time easier.

The brakes work great in the driveway (400' long) and the road out in front of the house. 
Next,  Road Test!

Eileen says she hasn't see me smile like that since before we lost our old dog at Thanksgiving.

The test drive went very well.  The brakes worked fine and no smoke from the wheel bearings. 
No pulling or dragging. I don't miss the grinding sounds from the left front.  I am very happy
with the results. You guys are really great.  I would have never tried to do this job with out
the detail and wealth of information on this site.  Thanks again!

Now, officially, having fun in the desert!

Thanks

Keith





|UPDATED|12/23/2011 6:35:30 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|


____________________________________

Nobody ever waves when I'm driving the Explorer.
K Woody
 Reply Reply  Quote Reply w/Quote
 New Topic New Topic Post Reply Reply New Poll New Poll Search     Search Page [1] 2  
 Forums -> C3 Handling Components
(Moderator: Adam Wartell, Norsky, Adams' Apple)
 

 
Official C3 Vette Registry Community:
Home | Forums | Email | Who's Online | Clubs | Events | Member Stats

Other Official C3 Vette Registry Areas:
Members | Research | Shop | My Account | About C3VR
 

Corvette is a registered trademark of the General Motors Corporation(GM) & Chevrolet Motor Division. Vette Registries, LLC is responsible for all site content (except for member submitted content or where otherwise noted) and does not claim or imply that Chevrolet or GM is responsible for Official C3 Vette Registry content. Vette Registries, LLC is independent from GM and is not affiliated with, sponsored or supported by GM.  Copyright/trademark/sales mark infringements are not intended, or implied and are in fact used to support GM, Chevrolet and Corvette

Official C3 Vette Registry content is Copyright 2001-2017, Vette Registries, LLC. Content may not be reused without written consent. All Rights Reserved. NS

Corvette (Vette) Model Years on this site: 1968 1969 1970 1971 1972 1973 1974 1975 1976 1977 1978 1979 1980 1981 1982 30