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1/1/08 1:43am - Original Message: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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Thanks to the heads up by Marshall that PC 0001 was at the Indy Auto Show I decided to drive down and have a look. Figured I'd also stop at the Indy Speedway Museum and check out what I think is PC 0002. Well, no luck at the speedway. They don't display the Pace Cars. I was told by a employee that she didn't even know where they're stored! Personally, I would rather see their Pace Car collection than all the antique race cars.
 
On to the auto show. There it was!! Looked at it with a very critical eye, just how I am! I wish GM took better care of such a special Vette!
 
Paint on the hood and surround badly cracked and scratched from dusting.
Incorrect black tinted tops instead of the mirrored tops. They actually had an 81 VIN engraved on the pass side. Was dated Aug80. Someone must have misplaced the correct ones!
Undercarriage was sloppily painted with spray cans; exhaust, dirt and grease included.
Power antenna replaced with a stationary mast.
Had an 8track/CB radio which wasn't offered in 78 on Corvettes(??)
Drivers seat showed a little more wear than a 716 mile car should show. Probably careless guys moving the car around.
 
mkapp78792008-01-01 12:48:22
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1/1/08 2:23am - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
cilrah Lifetime Member
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San Tan Valley, AZ - USA

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1978 Indy Pace Car 4851 of 6502, Auto, L-48

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Great pictures Mike, thanks Clap
 
Heres the 0001 picture for the article I'm writing for the 30th anniversary of the 78 pace Car.
cilrah2008-01-01 00:08:11

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1/1/08 9:47am - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
dwright Gold Member
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Nice pics Mike.
Did anyone step on you when you were getting the undercarriage shots?
It is a shame that it is not as pristine as it should be.
You would think that GM would have more pride.


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1/1/08 11:10am - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
lukesvette Lifetime Member
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Was this car ever owned privately or was it always in GM hands?

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1/1/08 1:39pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
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Great shots, Mike! Thanx for sharing those.
Yeah, it sux GM don't take care of stuff like this...dam shame. Mitchell would've never allowed it to get in that condition while he was around, I bet.

Looks like they got that thing tied to the floor, so someone don't get in it, and drive off...in front of thousands of people!

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1/1/08 3:27pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
ranger3 Lifetime Member
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Thanks for the great shots Mike. I love the Pace Cars and this is truly a piece of history. What a shame that it has been neglected and left in this shape.

Scott


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1/1/08 3:41pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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[QUOTE=LukesVette]Was this car ever owned privately or was it always in GM hands?[/QUOTE]
 
From what I read this Pace Car went straight to GM's "museum". I'm not sure but I don't think it was even at Indy for the race.
 
Don't get me wrong on the condition, It's still a beautiful Vette, especially considering it's origin. Other than the sloppy undercarriage, it has "character"!(but I wonder how it was stored to let the paint crack up?)
 
No one tripped over me taking the undercarriage shots, but I attracted the attention of one of the reps there. He's the one that took the VIN and speedo pics for me!
 


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1/1/08 4:14pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
manget1 Lifetime Member
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Thanks for getting those closer shots Mike. 
 
The car I saw last year at the track (I assume it was the #2 that the 500 Museum claims to have - I forgot to check the VIN at the time) had the same holes on the top of the rear end.  Those are for the flags for the race.  The one that was at the track had stickers on the console indicating the radio frequency the driver should ahve been on.  Surprising this one doesn't have one.  That could either mean someone "cleaned" them off, not understanding their significance, or that it never had them , possibly supporting the idea that it was never at the track.  Interesting...
 


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1/1/08 4:29pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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Marshall, thanks for that additional pic. Close inspection seems to shows it as the same radio as in 0001. Apparently they used the AM/FM/8track/CB combo that was available in higher end GM cars in 78. That is not the regular production UP6 AM/FM/CB radio offered in the Corvettes that year.
Also notice it's another automatic. So much for the speculation that all the track cars were 4speeds.
One more pic. Notice the radio had 2 sliders under the display and no CB readout showing like the normal 78 Corvette CB. This was a new radio available in 78, probably for Cadillacs, Buicks, etc.
Also, is that the clip for the mic under the glovebox?
mkapp78792008-01-01 13:46:16

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1/1/08 5:17pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
cilrah Lifetime Member
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[QUOTE=mkapp7879][QUOTE=LukesVette]Was this car ever owned privately or was it always in GM hands?[/QUOTE]
 
From what I read this Pace Car went straight to GM's "museum". I'm not sure but I don't think it was even at Indy for the race.
 [/QUOTE]
 
I could be wrong but doesn't this look like the same car you two just saw at the show.
 
 
The below picture is Al Unser's Pace Car, I'm not even going to guess what the VIN is until I hear back from Al.
 


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MARK
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1/1/08 6:11pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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Could be??? I looked back at the pics Marshall took back in June at the Indy car show and the Vette apparently owned by the museum doesn't have the 2 names on the sides. Neither does the one pictured as Unsers.
The info I went by is from the "Chronology of the Chevrolet Corvette" which simply states 0001 went to the "museum in Detroit" while 0002 and 0003 were used at Indy. 'The Pace Car that is driven is given to race winner Al Unser".
 
Also, I noticed the same non power antenna on the Indy Museum's Pace Car.


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1/2/08 11:32am - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
BlueX2 Lifetime Member
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Thanks for sharing all of this info with us. It's cool to read about what you guys are finding.   

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1/2/08 1:11pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
steves74 Lifetime Member
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I also enjoyed the pictures.  Thanks Mike.
 Dumb question...can you get a 78 pace car with manual trans???
 If so, how rare are they?   Thanks

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74 coupe 4 speed 350, 54K actual miles,
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split  bumper. #'s match. 2nd owner, no stress cracks.
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1/2/08 2:50pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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[QUOTE=cilrah]
 
I could be wrong but doesn't this look like the same car you two just saw at the show.
[/QUOTE]
 
Mark, that sure does look like 0001. I've seen that pic before and assumed they had names on all 3 Pace Cars.
Spent a while last night googling various Pace Car combinations and looked through a few Corvette books I have from the early 80s. All of the promo shots at the race track show the Pace Car without the names on em. So the following is just my SPECULATION.....
 
In another post on the other Pace Car thread you stated that Al Unser sold the 71 Charger he received for that race because it wasn't the actual Pace Car and therefore held no real meaning for him. Well, he's held on to the 78 Corvette for 30 years now so it probably means a lot to him. The ACTUAL race used car? VIN 0002? No names on the doors.(would he take the names off??).
 
The Pace Car owned by the Indy Museum was probably the back up. Also no names. Being a museum I doubt they would remove names from the doors. 0003?
 
0001 owned by GM with the names on the doors.....maybe just used for a few pre race laps so the celebrities(Rathman and Cloutier, whoever he was)could wave to the fans. I would think that pic is not during the race with the guy waving to the crowd and all! And names on the doors so people would know who the heck they were waving at!
 
There were no Corvette parade or courtesy cars. Those were either Camaros or Monte Carlos.
 
Mark, get me in through your contact Ellen to see the museum's Pace Car and I'll head right down there again!!


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1/2/08 3:36pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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One more observation I made at the Indy Auto Show. They had an information placard in front of the 0001(should hve taken a pic!!). One of the statements was about the first 300 units having special Goodyear tires with "Corvette" on them. We know this didn't happen. So how much other info was wrong? Anyway, it also stated a different cam was installed(L82 cam or something bigger?) and special dual exhaust. What did they mean by "special"? 0001 had factory Y into a cat and to the Y again.
It would be interesting to get a look underneath the speedway's and Unsers' Pace Cars to see if there's true duals.


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1/2/08 6:09pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
jayare
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Mark & Mike....good...Good stuff Clap
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1/2/08 9:22pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
dwright Gold Member
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Victor, NY - USA

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2004 Commemorative Edition Coupe, Auto w/HUD. 13K miles in 2015. Sold 1982 Red Coupe

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[QUOTE=steves74]I also enjoyed the pictures.  Thanks Mike.
 Dumb question...can you get a 78 pace car with manual trans???
 If so, how rare are they?   Thanks [/QUOTE]
 
There is nothing in the Black Book that says you couldn't order the 4-speed for your PC. In fact it says all options were available.
 
No cost addition for the manual or auto.
 
Out of 46,776 built that year, only 3,385 ordered the 4-speed.
38,614 got the automatic.
That only totals 41,999, so not sure of these numbers.
and of course, there is no way to tell how many PC got 4-speeds, but i am sure there were a few.
 
We actually have 4 members listed with a PC VIN and manual tranny. One is listed as a 3-speed manual. (Former member Timmer)
 
Is it possible that the 3-speed manual was standard?
 
The plot thickens.Shocked


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1/2/08 10:48pm - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
mkapp7879
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[QUOTE=dwright][QUOTE=steves74]I also enjoyed the pictures.  Thanks Mike.
 Dumb question...can you get a 78 pace car with manual trans???
 If so, how rare are they?   Thanks [/QUOTE]
 
There is nothing in the Black Book that says you couldn't order the 4-speed for your PC. In fact it says all options were available.
 
No cost addition for the manual or auto.
 
Out of 46,776 built that year, only 3,385 ordered the 4-speed.
38,614 got the automatic.
That only totals 41,999, so not sure of these numbers.
and of course, there is no way to tell how many PC got 4-speeds, but i am sure there were a few.
 
We actually have 4 members listed with a PC VIN and manual tranny. One is listed as a 3-speed manual. (Former member Timmer)
 
Is it possible that the 3-speed manual was standard?
 
The plot thickens.Shocked
[/QUOTE]
 
 
The discrepency in transmission numbers is because the wide ratio 4speed was standard and not listed in the options charts.  The 3385 4speeds listed were for the close ratio units that were only available with the L82. If ya didn't check the option box or ya got an L48 then you got the wide ratio.
No 3 speeds offered, that must be a typo.
Speculation says about 250 4speed Pace Cars produced. But mostly a guess.
mkapp78792008-01-02 21:21:27

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1/3/08 12:09am - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
cilrah Lifetime Member
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San Tan Valley, AZ - USA

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1978 Indy Pace Car 4851 of 6502, Auto, L-48

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There were no 3-speed tranny's, no special exhaust, and certainly no tires with Corvette on them.
 
The Pace Car with Jim Rathman on it was the actual Pace Car, the honorary Pace Car driver actually drives the Pace lap.  The 71 Pace Car driver was a Dodge Dealer from the Indy area, and apparently not very experienced in driving at high speeds, he wrecked the car during the actual race.  I believe the Rathman car was the only car that actually Paced the race the others were spares inwhich Indy kept one and Al got the other, was there a fourth? Hell I don't know.
 
And yes Mike, there were Monte Carlos there in 78, I've got pictures of the Hurst (shifter) Girls riding round the track in a Monte Carlo.
 
I just purchased a huge package of pictures from the 78 Indy 500 from a guy whos Pacer used to be on display at the NCM.  All pictures of the Pace Car and one of the Monte Carlo.


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1/3/08 1:08am - Reply: 'MORE 78 Pace Car 0001 pics'
cilrah Lifetime Member
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San Tan Valley, AZ - USA

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1978 Indy Pace Car 4851 of 6502, Auto, L-48

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Heres one of the two pics I have of the Monte Carlo that was at Indy in 78. cilrah2008-01-02 22:09:22

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MARK
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"Keep up the Pace"
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