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Topic: Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

in Forum: C3 Driveline Components


Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 1:20am Message 1 of 17
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DOWNINGTOWN, PA - USA
Joined: 11/24/2001
Posts: 962
Vette(s): 1969 Monza Red Black Conv / Black Vinal hardtop 454/480 Tremec 5 Speed 308 Posi.Black Leather Interior, PS, PW, Air cond., tilt/tele,AM/FM Cass.-5 Pack CD, Hurst Shifter, side pipes 2004 Yellow convertible with black top and black interior

  I recently replaced my engine and transmission ( see engine forum ).  My new trans is a Tremec TKO 550  5 speed (Keisler Perfect Fit series).  If anyone is planning to replace their trans with one of these units, you would be strongly advised to consider it carefully.

  The trans appears to be everything that it is advertised to be.  It did however, take us 8 1/2 hours to remove the M21 and get the Tremec installed.  Now mind you, neither of us believes in reading instructions.  To actually take about 15 minutes and read them might have just saved us around and hour and a half and a lot of sweat and cursing!

  The problems we encountered:

1.  The bellhousing has to be removed and slipped over the inputshaft of the transmission while you are holding the trans on it's side jammed over the crossmember.  Now think about aligning the clutch and throwout bearing while holding the bellhousing and trans.

2.  The trans mount holes had to be elongated for the bolts to fit.

3.  While driving home, the new LARGER yoke cut through my emergency brake cable.

4.  Even though all the machine marks were lined up, the LARGER yoke was banging against the fiberglass floor boards.

5.  If you buy it and they offer you a new clutch plate, TAKE IT cause the clutch plate you have won't fit the input shaft ( wrong spline count ).

6.  The speedometer gear they supplied was incorrect even though it was the correct color.  On the chassis dyno, with my speedometer reading 78 mph, my actual ground speed was 65mph

7.  Now I am left with a choise:  I know the clutch won't last till I sell the car , do I cut the crossmember and make it a removeable unit so I can actually get the trans out of the way to replace the clutch or spend another day's labor fighting the crossmember? Or do I pay a professional five or six hundred bucks to change it for me every time it needs replacing?  Normally I would not hesitate to do surgery on the crossmember but if I do, it will surely lower the value of the car.

When I contacted Keisler Engineering about my problems, they said "well, on a '69 if you have a problem it will be with the e-brake."  "Well, with a '69, if you have a problem it will be with the larger yoke hitting the floor."  "Well, with a '69 we have ocassionally exprianced the need to elongate the bolt holes."  Well hell, the chassis is the same from '63 to '82 so I guess all their "perfect fit" series will have the same possible problems regardless of the year of the Corvette!  Actually the only 'perfect fit' was the shifter.  It is exactly where it should be with regards to fit in the stock console.

Any thoughts on the crossmember?

Glenn




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Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 2:25am Message 2 of 17
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baytown, TX - USA
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 160
Vette(s): 1979 maui blue/doe skin, fuel injected 383, 6-speed manual, hooker sidepipes, 3.90 gear
Perfect fit huh? The crossmember on my 79 bolts in. Yours does'nt?


Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 4:39am Message 3 of 17
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Newark, DE - USA
Joined: 7/26/2004
Posts: 468
Vette(s): 1968 Conv, 454HO,500HP-600TQ, TKO-600,3:70 HD rear,hotrod air, custom paint & suspension,1973 Ruby Red,T-top, 383 Stroker, TK)-500,frame off restro, 1967 Dodge Coronet, 340 stroker to 406, Dana 60

Had the same problems as you , but I cut my cross member which made my install much easier. I purchased mine from classic 5 sp chevy. They were very helpful. I saw that the cable was to close so I moved it to the side. Never did get the speedo to work correctly. I replaced the clutch,throw out bearing & pressure plate also. When you cut the crossmember..(I had to design my own as it was 3 yr ago) it made installing the trans pretty easy. Had no problems with bolts.  The cross members on automatic cars bolts on the cross member on 4 spd is welded.  Glenn it's bad I didn't know about your install...probably could have saved you some headaches as I'm only about an hour from you. Also read about negative experience with Keisler that's why I went with class5sppedchevy.

Alan

 




                                               

Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 5:31am Message 4 of 17
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Frederick, MD - USA
Joined: 9/8/2003
Posts: 3398
Vette(s): 1969 convertible L71 427/435 4-speed black interior
I don't have any personal experience with Keisler but I know the Mopar people hate Keisler with a passion. When I had my '67 Charger I read of many problems Mopar owners had dealing with Keisler. I've also seen nothing but glowing reports of Keisler and their products in the car magazines, but I would expect when a major car mag calls and says they want to do a piece on your product, you would bend over backwards to give first class service and product.


Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 7:34am Message 5 of 17
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WEST SENECA, NY - USA
Joined: 12/3/2001
Posts: 2379
Vette(s): 1981 Blue Ice Met. w/pearl ghost flames TKO500 5speed. LS1 Swap 3.45 Dana 44.

It's to bad that GM just didn't make all transmission crossmembers bolted in. I don't know what year they did smart'n up with a bolt in (4 spd) crossmember, but I was thankful they did on my '81. Swapping out the "blown" Borg Warner-T10 for a Richmond T10 was a breeze. Unfortunately the 5 spd Tremec kit wasn't available when I did this, otherwise I would have put that in.

Just my opinion: Since your car is already modified, I would cut and modify the crossmember for ease of servicing.  

Sarge





GEN III 5.7L "LS6" Engine swap
TKO500 5 spd.
3.54 Dana 44
'69 "N11" Sidepipes
Borgeson Steering Box
Born 8/1981
Sequence #3975




Click here to see more pics of my Vette on CarDomain.


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Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 7:54am Message 6 of 17
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Piscataway, NJ - USA
Joined: 10/16/2002
Posts: 106
Vette(s): 1973 coupe silver Eng.383 stroker. Tremec 5spd 1977 L48 Stock
 I saw the hat trick install with the 4spd non removable crossmember. I am glad I put the auto frame in my 73. It is a breeze to drop the trans. Have had no problems with my tremec or Keisler.


Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 8:04am Message 7 of 17
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Lisle, IL - USA
Joined: 6/18/2002
Posts: 125
Vette(s): 1973 coupe Under Construction

I am probably going to go with a tremec 5 speed when I get to that point, its nice to here the issues that other people have had with there installs. It sounds like I will avoid most of them since I have an automatic frame and my x member is bolted in. 

More importantly, Now that it is installed how does it drive?  Even if it took me all day to put in I would put up with it since im going on 1 year and a half building a car I have never driven in the first place.




Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/17/06 8:10am Message 8 of 17
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Piscataway, NJ - USA
Joined: 10/16/2002
Posts: 106
Vette(s): 1973 coupe silver Eng.383 stroker. Tremec 5spd 1977 L48 Stock
  One important note is the routing of the speedo cable if you have stock out the back exhaust. The cable can get fried. Side exhaust no problem. 


Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/19/06 3:44am Message 9 of 17
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DOWNINGTOWN, PA - USA
Joined: 11/24/2001
Posts: 962
Vette(s): 1969 Monza Red Black Conv / Black Vinal hardtop 454/480 Tremec 5 Speed 308 Posi.Black Leather Interior, PS, PW, Air cond., tilt/tele,AM/FM Cass.-5 Pack CD, Hurst Shifter, side pipes 2004 Yellow convertible with black top and black interior

To answer one of the questions, the car drives very well.  The only issues I have now that it is installed are, the trans sounds like it is dry in third gear and any kind of a power or speed shift between 2-3 usually lands me in 5th or hung up in the neutral gate.  I guess that is from too many years wailing on a 4 speed: haven't yet learned the subtilties of a 5 speed.

I hope to get the car out on the turn pike in July to check out gas mileage.  I am right around 2000 rpm at 70.  That should put me at approx. 130 hp and 350 foot pounds of torque.  Around town, the car is almost unmanageable under 55 in 5th gear.  It just lugs and bucks.  Even though it is a small cam, it needs more rpm.  A lower rear would fix it also but that is kinda self defeating.  That brings up another point, even with my 308 rear, first gear is almost non-existant on a hard take-off due to the 327:1 first gear in the trans.  When I get some gas mileage figures, I will post them.




Tremec (Keisler) 5 speed

Posted: 6/19/06 4:25am Message 10 of 17
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Newark, DE - USA
Joined: 7/26/2004
Posts: 468
Vette(s): 1968 Conv, 454HO,500HP-600TQ, TKO-600,3:70 HD rear,hotrod air, custom paint & suspension,1973 Ruby Red,T-top, 383 Stroker, TK)-500,frame off restro, 1967 Dodge Coronet, 340 stroker to 406, Dana 60

I have a 3.70 rear in mine & can drive fine in 5th gear over 40 mph. Went to a show in NJ a few weeks ago and drove 80-90 on the turnpike for about 40 miles & the rest on back roads & towns . Total miles 120 averaged 17.2mpg. Which is pretty consistant as I've figured cruising around I average 15-17mpg. My trans felt tight for awhile too...now it feels fine. Going from 2 to 3rd is straight up..not up & over ..took my awhile to get used to. I still start out in 3rd sometimes if I'm not paying attention. The TKO-600 1st gear isn't as low as the TKO-550 & 5th is .64.

Alan




                                               

in Forum: C3 Driveline Components


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