Home page
SPONSOR AD SPONSOR AD

Topic: Hot start blues

in Forum: C3 Electrical


Hot start blues

Posted: 5/20/05 10:33am Message 21 of 40
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Send PM
Frederick, MD - USA
Joined: 2/20/2003
Posts: 548
Vette(s): Frederick County Corvette Club (Maryland) Tan 64 365 Hp Conv 4 sp Red 72 4 sp Conv ..running a '68 327 Blue 76 Coupe L 48 4 sp White 79 Coupe L 82 auto Silver 98 Conv, 6 sp 35th Anniv '88 vette

Dear 74-454     You seem to be adding to the myth that starts out
stating that the first thing you need to do when working on a Corvette
is to disassemble the entire car... LOL... It does seem that way alot I will admit BUT !!!!!

You have a big block...and none of my Corvettes are BB's... but I do have headers ...and to be honest I  do not see why you would have to remove them to get to the starter...that would be a major pain in the rear...    And I have NEVER taken the wheel off to gain space..it is no where close to where you will be laying on your back...

That replacement solenoid may not help....the spring may be the same strenght as the original... but for 12 bucks I most likely would have
opened my wallet also...

I can replace the solenoid spring in maybe 30 minutes on any of my Corvettes...from the time I walked out the back door of the house till I
walked back into the house...AND I AM NOT FAST....   If the headers
present "any" problem I would go the route of mounting a remote selenoid...

Strange but this problem could have been solved and completely eleminated by GM 40 years ago....wonder why they mounted it on the starter?  must save money ...Ford had a better idea...

Lots of luck...

Bob



Bob
64,72 & 98 Corvette Ragtops
76 & 79 & qa 88 ANC Corvette Coupes

Click on any image for larger view!

SPONSOR AD:: (Our Sponsors help support C3VR)

Hot start blues

Posted: 5/20/05 11:22am Message 22 of 40
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Send PM
Canada
Joined: 8/6/2004
Posts: 533
Vette(s): Coupe 74 - 454 Drive it like you stole it!
Bob,
 
maybe I don't need to take the wheel off to get some elbow space, just remembered that last time I got near the starter to look at it, the stand was on the other side , that could have been why it felt a little tight over there.
 
I just called my local Chevy dealer and an AcDelco parts center and both of them told me that part 1958679 was discontinued.
 
I figured I would put this spring in the Wells solenoid, but I can't find it.  I'll just go ahead with the plan now that I have a plan B (the remote solenoid).
 
Thanks for the "timing", as I am slow myself.  I always get distracted by something else while being there.
 
 



Hot start blues

Posted: 5/20/05 4:50pm Message 23 of 40
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Send PM
Frederick, MD - USA
Joined: 2/20/2003
Posts: 548
Vette(s): Frederick County Corvette Club (Maryland) Tan 64 365 Hp Conv 4 sp Red 72 4 sp Conv ..running a '68 327 Blue 76 Coupe L 48 4 sp White 79 Coupe L 82 auto Silver 98 Conv, 6 sp 35th Anniv '88 vette

OH NO..... I think I still have one more of those springs in the garage
but honestly I can not tell them apart from the originals...

This being Friday.... that means I can not talk to my parts manager and find out what he has to say... A quick look on the internet also showed no results ... The part was located in the GM parts book under
                  Springs Group # 2
         &nbs p;        Part number 1958679 

     Guess I will have to have my local dealer do a search of other dealers andd see if he can get me another spare...


I can see why they discontinued it...had to be a hot selling item..lol
But when something works and has proven it works over an extended period of time...seems somebody should make a replacement..

Lots of Luck...

Bob Griffiths
.



Bob
64,72 & 98 Corvette Ragtops
76 & 79 & qa 88 ANC Corvette Coupes

Click on any image for larger view!

Hot start blues

Posted: 5/20/05 6:17pm Message 24 of 40
Profile Pic
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Moderator
Send PM
CUYAHOGA FALLS, OH - USA
Joined: 12/2/2003
Posts: 6424
Vette(s): 1975 C3 Red, T-Tops, Black Interior. All I need is time and money! Getting there!
A remote solenoid won't help you if the solenoid on the starter won't work.  You still need to engage the starter. 


Hot start blues

Posted: 5/20/05 8:08pm Message 25 of 40
Profile Pic
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Moderator
Send PM
Duncanville, TX - USA
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 20214
Vette(s): #1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas
Thees ees true, BUT......It does require that the solenoid be in working condition. What you have to do is:
Take the purple wire (12v from ign switch) off of the solenoid. Make ajumper to go from the batt. term on the sol. to where you took the purple wire off. Extend the purple wire to where-ever you mount the remote sol. Then do the same with the cable from the batt. to the starter; it needs to be put on the new sol. Then run a new cable from the remote sol. down to the starter, and you're done. While it may not make sense that this would work, because you're still using the sol. on the starter, beleive me, it does work! I've used this setup on every BB drag car, drag boat, sprint car, wrecker, etc. I've ever driven, and I've never had to drown the starter to cool it off enough to start!


Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    

My Link


(click for Texas-sized view!)
             NCRS

"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"

Hot start blues

Posted: 5/21/05 4:34am Message 26 of 40
Former Member
Send PM
Gillette, WY - USA
Joined: 3/28/2004
Posts: 67
Vette(s): 1960 (got wiped out in the Rapid City flood of 72), 1968 roadster(sold it so I could buy the 71), 1971 Coupe Chromed almost everything underneath. Had it since "76"
That curved piece goes on the top hole of the started motor. The long bolt that goes through the motor winding should have a stud on the end of it. you have probably seen this bolt on starters and wondered what it was for, the other end bolts to the side of the block. The flat piece with the bend in it has a hole in it and it should line up with the hole in the middle of the other piece and cover, a small sheet metal screw holds the two together and it covers the side of your starter solenoid.


If it's not painted, Chrome it!!!

Hot start blues

Posted: 5/21/05 8:03am Message 27 of 40
Profile Pic
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Moderator
Send PM
CUYAHOGA FALLS, OH - USA
Joined: 12/2/2003
Posts: 6424
Vette(s): 1975 C3 Red, T-Tops, Black Interior. All I need is time and money! Getting there!

I agree it does work.  It's due to the voltage drops through the system.   I just didn't want anyone to go that way alone with a solenoid problem.  That would be frustrating.

Good description Joel. 




Hot start blues

Posted: 5/21/05 8:23am Message 28 of 40
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Send PM
Canada
Joined: 8/6/2004
Posts: 533
Vette(s): Coupe 74 - 454 Drive it like you stole it!
This is becoming way more difficult than expected.
 
After I replace the solenoid and put it all back, when I reconnected the (-) to the battery, there was a spark!   (I really went thru a range of emotions last night.) Now everything is dead.
 
I must have not ground it correctly.  I can revisit my solenoid/starter wires to make sure everything is fine, but what else do I have to do ? If I blew a fuse, is it one of them inside (bottom left of driver side) or some obscure fuse in the engine.  I couldn't find much from the service manual.
 
BTW :
1) the headers didn't have to come off, but I could have used more elbow space
2) as said before, starters are heavy when you don't have enough space. had to use a stand to rest the starter on it to align the 2 mounting bolt. That was clever .
3) the new heatshield (way bigger than the original and with a thermal layer) will most likely make a big difference. can't wait to see the effect (or should I say Not see the effect of heat)
 
And finally; unrelated, but I removed my spare tire casing and I FOUND MY BUILD SHEET . Well, half of it, and totally covered with grease.  Really nothing to look at, but I'm still keeping it!
 



Hot start blues

Posted: 5/21/05 7:36pm Message 29 of 40
Profile Pic
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Moderator
Send PM
Duncanville, TX - USA
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 20214
Vette(s): #1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/ Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight" #2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas
Congrats on finding at least part of the 'Holy grail' of Corvettedom!!
Most likely you have melted a fuse-link at the starter. Does anything work? Headlights, horn, etc., or will it just not start? If everything is dead now, you're gonna have to locate the fuse-links in the wiring about 6-8 inches up from the starter, and check to see if they are good or blown. Use a test light or a voltmeter, and test on both sides of the link(s). If you find power on the starter side, but not on the other side of the link, then that link is blown. A fuse link is a small, round 'fuse' in the wiring, covered with a soft rubbery like thing. It will be about 1-1 1/2' long, sometimes black, sometimes tan/white, always a PITA!!! They can be cut out and the remaining wires tied together just to get you down the road, but considering your luck , I would just go ahead and get new fuse-links to put back in. You can get them at most parts houses. There are a couple of the fuse links at the junction block on the driver's side fenderwell too, I think. Look and see if your car has any there, and if so, check those while you're at it. I hope you get 'er going soon, it's that time -o- year!!! Cruizin weather!! BTW......You need to determine WHY the fuse-link(s) blew, before you repeat the same thing. Check your wiring on the starter carefully(well..duh! ). You may have made a simple mistake that you will see when you check it out. Don't get too frustrated, we've ALL been there!!!


Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56    

My Link


(click for Texas-sized view!)
             NCRS

"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"

Hot start blues

Posted: 5/21/05 8:08pm Message 30 of 40
Profile Pic
Lifetime MemberLifetime Member
Moderator
Send PM
CUYAHOGA FALLS, OH - USA
Joined: 12/2/2003
Posts: 6424
Vette(s): 1975 C3 Red, T-Tops, Black Interior. All I need is time and money! Getting there!
And if it is a fusiable link, make sure you use the EXACT same size gauge and length.  Other wise it will not be properly protected and allow something to fry, or may be over protected and blow too easily.


in Forum: C3 Electrical


SPONSOR AD: (Our Sponsors help support C3VR)