Topic: Wheel spacing woes continue
in Forum: C3 Engines, Driveline and Handling
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Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
I've basically been dead the water for a year on my project.
All becuase even though the body spacing measures out good, the front wheels dont line up in the wheel wells.
the left front is about 3/4" further back than the right front.
I measured from the rear jig holes to the lower ball joints and I am out 1/4" across the frame.
This means my centerline is off by 1/8", withing spec.
better still. from the front jig holes I am off 1/16".
This tells me the lower ball joint is probably in the right place. So now I am looking at the upper control arm.
Does anyone have a known good upper control arm that I can borrow and use to compare the position?
at this point if there is a problem I will probably buy a modern performance replacement but I would rather not spend a bunch of money and have the problem be something else.
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Duncanville, TX - USA
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 20224
Vette(s): #1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/
Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight"
#2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto
Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas
If I had one loose, I'd send it to ya Ben....but I don't. Don't know of anyone in the area that has one off to check, either. Something fishy with what you have, for sure.....just don't know what.
Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56 
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"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"
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Carson City, NV - USA
Joined: 12/4/2013
Posts: 239
Vette(s): Numbers matching 1972 350 4 speed, silver pewter body with blue interior
How are your alignment numbers on the bad side of the car? Castor/camber? Tons of shims in there? I've seen control arm bushings so shot that a front tire would hit the forward edge of the wheel well when in reverse and then center itself in the wheel when moving forward. And even then with the car on jack stands you couldn't push it fore/aft with your hands. They stay tight and need a load to show their slop. Free thinking here.....
My Christmas present to ME! Bought Sat 11-30-2013. 72, 350 4 spd, Silver with blue interior...Can't you just hear Pablo Cruz playing in the background?
Lifetime MemberModerator
Duncanville, TX - USA
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 20224
Vette(s): #1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/
Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight"
#2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto
Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas
A little history here, Dave...this car has been going thru a major resto/renovation for several years. Everything is NEW...
Ben has been trying to figure out this wheel issue for some time, but he only has a finite amount of time to work on the car. There is another thread here with pics of both sides for comparison, along with details on measurements, etc. I'll see if I can find it and post a link.
Ben has been trying to figure out this wheel issue for some time, but he only has a finite amount of time to work on the car. There is another thread here with pics of both sides for comparison, along with details on measurements, etc. I'll see if I can find it and post a link.
Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56
My Link
(click for Texas-sized view!) NCRS
"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
With the bottom of the front fender at 9 3/4" from the ground on both sides.
|UPDATED|4/15/2014 7:38:52 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
After I removed all the spacers (appx 3/8") from the rear of the drivers upper control arm, the left front tire is 2 5/8" from the rear of the front wheel well.
The passenger side is 3 1/8" from the rear of the passenger wheel well. It moved the wheel forward appx 1/4" but it is still out a 1/2" and I doubt it is alignable now as well. As it was in alignment before I took the shims out.
|UPDATED|4/15/2014 7:38:52 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
I heard that you can install the control arms backwards and it moves your wheel too far forward.
I wonder if maybe the drivers side is correct and passenger is wrong. I also need a redneck way to measure caster angle if anyone knows of one.
I am running 245/60/15 on stock wheels. If you have a 68-72 and tires this size or at least close (I can always adjust for radius) can you measure the distance from the rear of your fender to the wheel.
you need to use a tape measure along the angle of the rocker molding.
|UPDATED|4/15/2014 10:03:39 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Former Member
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Carson City, NV - USA
Joined: 12/4/2013
Posts: 239
Vette(s): Numbers matching 1972 350 4 speed, silver pewter body with blue interior
Got ya...sounds like the basics have been covered and then some. If all the bolt on parts have been verified correct / undamaged....I might run it through a floor mapping with plumb bob / laser level etc. If the bolt ons are not the prob, I'd be inclined to think the attachment points are off....as in tweaked frame. With the body on, you can check the frame by getting under it, use the bob, framing square and tape measure to find the cars center line, from there create perpendicular lines running across and under the troublesome suspension area. Use the plumb to chart the suspension attachment points onto the floor. Measure and compare each side. Click here to see a pic of a mapped floor before removing the cars front clip. I put tape down to mark up with a sharpie. The outboard tape shows the spindle, ball joint and axle center line locations before removing the bolt ons. It should be roughly aligned for the these marks to have relevance.
(large image modified to a clickable link - Norsky)
|UPDATED|4/16/2014 1:34:35 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
(large image modified to a clickable link - Norsky)
|UPDATED|4/16/2014 1:34:35 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
My Christmas present to ME! Bought Sat 11-30-2013. 72, 350 4 spd, Silver with blue interior...Can't you just hear Pablo Cruz playing in the background?
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
Have you heard about someone having the the wrong side upper control arm or maybe having a bent one.
I replaced the bushings but I am using the control arms that came on the car when i got it
With the crappy work that had been done on this car before I have no idea if the part has been replaced
It was wrecked on the passenger side.
I also measured the distance to the front of the wheel well
The nose support isn't in the car so the nose is drooping some and not necessary evenly to left and right
But the drivers spacing is 3 1/4" and passenger is 3"
So overall driver is 3 1/4" front and 2 5/8" rear
Pass is 3" front and 3 1/8" rear
|UPDATED|4/15/2014 11:50:53 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
|UPDATED|4/15/2014 11:50:53 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
can anyone tell me the wheel spacing on the front wheels of a 68-72 as I described above? let me know your tire size too so I can adjust the measurements relative to mine.
is there a decent frame diagram in the assembly diagram that I am missing. there is a one page diagram (UPC 2) that is basically useless as I assume the factory received the frames pre built and tested.
I have found a body shop with a laser frame machine that is going to check my frame out, their software doesn't go back to 69 so they need definitive frame specs.
the gm chassis service manual has a decent diagram but I wanted to know if anyone had a definitive diagram. This diagram for example shows the distance between the front frame section but not the distance between the control arm brackets.
that spec. the distance between the control arms is a measurement I will definitely need.
I have 16" rims/tires on "The Toy" but they supposedly have the same outer dimensions as the 15" tires. I'll get out in the garage tonight or tomorrow night and do some measuring.
(e-mail sent with pics - Thursday PM)
|UPDATED|4/17/2014 7:57:08 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
(e-mail sent with pics - Thursday PM)
|UPDATED|4/17/2014 7:57:08 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Jim Olson 
"The Toys"...!!! Save the Wave! 
in Forum: C3 Engines, Driveline and Handling
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