Topic: Fluid Leak...Not Sure What This Is
in Forum: C3 Engines
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VMan73 - ugh so sorry for the name confusion! I corrected in my response.
Will let you know how things go. I'm lucky. I have a career that allows me work from home a few days a week. The water pump is my goal for the week :)
"You know, we always called each other goodfellas. Like you'd say to somebody: You're gonna like this guy, he's all right. He's a goodfella. He's one of us. You understand?"
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When you go get the water pump you will need to get two gaskets for the pump. The gaskets are sold separately and individually. Trying to save you from making two trips to parts store.Check the belts for cracks and excessive wear. Now would be the time to change them if you haven't already. Never throw out any original parts!!!!
Thank you Redwoman! I will definitely check those belts for cracks and I will be sure to grab 2 gaskets.
So far I've been good at keeping items I have replaced: old shift console, old arm rest, master cylinder cover, oil cap and radiator cap. I'm really considering rebuilding water pump if it turns out to be original. If not, I will replace and keep.
GoT! The fight with Mountain and the prince! The siege on Castle Black! Is Sensa really marrying that psycho Ramses??? Gah! I can't take it!!
:)
Jason
"You know, we always called each other goodfellas. Like you'd say to somebody: You're gonna like this guy, he's all right. He's a goodfella. He's one of us. You understand?"
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Hey Jason - no problem, F4gary is a good guy and we've got to spread some appreciation his way too !!
So now on to Phase II - with the belts and the smog pump removed, we need to make a little more room by removing the smog pump mounting bracket and the upper radiator hose. The hose is pretty straight forward, just make sure to be careful if you do any twisting of the hose where it attaches to the elbow on the top of the radiator. Like the bottom end those connections to the radiator are thin metal brazed to the radiator tanks. You would not be the first person to rip the metal elbow right off the radiator by twisting it. Sounds like you have a good radiator, be gentle with it when taking hoses on or off.
So now back to the smog mounting bracket - you'll notice on the bottom it is held in place by one of the 4 bolts that attaches the water pump. Go ahead and take that bolt out and mark it top RH WP bolt or something you'll remember. The second bolt that holds the SP bracket on goes into the intake manifold, go ahead and remove it, mark it also and keep it with the smog pump bracket.
Now your ready for the fan, fan clutch and WP pulley. Prior to removing anything, make note of the clearance you have from the back of the pulley to the top of the water pump casting. You should a 1/16" or more. Use this as a reference to compare that same clearance when you install the new pump. 99% of the time that clearance will be the same and you'll be fine. If that clearance gets significantly tighter, you may have to shim the pump pulley out. We'll worry about that when your back in reassembly mode.
Leave the fan attached to the clutch (silver thing with the aluminum fins) and look for the four bolts holding the clutch to the WP. Remove each of those four nuts, if the stud comes with any of the nuts that's okay. With all four removed, move the fan and clutch forward and it should tilt backward and out of the radiator shroud. Be careful not to gouge the backside of the radiator with the fan blades. With the fan and clutch out of the car you can remove the WP pulley and clearly start to see the WP.
Disconnect the lower radiator hose from the pump along with the heater hose that is attached to the pump. Now is a good time to check the condition of both heater hoses and determine if they are in good shape or need replacement. If you chose to replace the heater hoses, note their routing down to the heater core and be very careful with their connections. The heater core is just a smaller version of the radiator and replacing one of those is C3 nightmare #2. If you go there, also make note that the hoses are two different sizes (5/8" and 3/4"). Smaller one to the intake, larger one to the pump. If I'm removing old hoses to replace, I prefer to gently cut them off with a sharp utility knife and avoid any excessive twisting. Reinstalling new hoses I always make sure the metal tube or elbow is clean and coat the inside of the hose with a small amount of Vaseline or just wet it with some new antifreeze.
So with the hoses out of the way, go back to the water pump bolts on the passenger side, one has already been removed when you took off the smog pump bracket, there is a second down lower, remove that bolt. You may get some antifreeze out of either bolt hole - nothing to worry about. Make sure to mark that bolt bottom RH WP.
With those two bolts out of the way, you'll notice there is another cast bracket overlapping the WP on that side, that bracket goes up to the A/C compressor. In order to get the pump in and out that bracket needs to be removed or swung out of the way to get the pump by, I prefer to remove it. That bracket is a two piece assembly and if you can locate and remove the correct bolts, that bracket can be removed while the second part stays attached to the A/C compressor. Here's a great place to take some pictures because once that bracket is out it may be a little confusing how it goes back in later.
So with the A/C bracket removed or out of the way the only thing holding the pump in place are the two bolts on the LH or driver's side. The top one should be the stud that was holding the smog pump and alt. tension brackets, the bottom should be just a simple bolt, mark both as top and bottom LH WP bolts. It may sound silly, but those four bolts are all different lengths and have caused more than a few guys problems on the reassembly.
With all four bolts removed and if your WP hasn't already fallen out, all that's holding it will be some gasket material and it should come out with a bit of a pry and wiggle of the WP. Congrats', your half way there !!
Let me know if you have any ??? or prefer a little less detail. I'll post up Phase III tomorrow.
Good Luck !!!
John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
NCRS Member 61302
NW NCRS Chapter Member
Duct tape is the new Black !!
OK Update: All belts and hoses are off and so is the complete fan shroud. All bolts/washers are marked and set aside. I took a lot of detailed pics. The smog pump is a real pain. The "pivot bolt" holding the smog pump in place does not clear the pulley attached to it. Tried to remove the smog pump pulley and it just spins and spins. Tried holding it steady to remove bolts and it just wouldn't go. I may have to leave the smog pump on. It pivots well out of the way.
First pic is looking toward water pump from driver's side. Second pic is looking toward water pump from passenger's side. The wet stuff is WD40 over spray.
I am printing out your Phase II instructions. I will report back once water pump is off :)
PS: What are the drawbacks of removing the smog pump for good? I can see how NOT having it there would give a lot more room to work and see the engine itself.
|UPDATED|8/31/2015 4:03:02 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
First pic is looking toward water pump from driver's side. Second pic is looking toward water pump from passenger's side. The wet stuff is WD40 over spray.
I am printing out your Phase II instructions. I will report back once water pump is off :)
PS: What are the drawbacks of removing the smog pump for good? I can see how NOT having it there would give a lot more room to work and see the engine itself.
|UPDATED|8/31/2015 4:03:02 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
"You know, we always called each other goodfellas. Like you'd say to somebody: You're gonna like this guy, he's all right. He's a goodfella. He's one of us. You understand?"
No problem, your doing good, good pics. Sorry, I forgot about removing the SP pulley. You should be able to leave the smog pump in it's bracket and remove both the pump and bracket. One bolt below on the water pump, the other one back on the intake manifold. Give that a try.
John Sigmund
valkman57@sbcglobal.net
NCRS Member 61302
NW NCRS Chapter Member
Duct tape is the new Black !!
Thank you! Worked hard this afternoon!
I just went out to the garage and took a quick peek. I see what you're saying about keeping the smog pump in its bracket and removing both as one piece.
What I'm not seeing is where the fan clutch meets the water pump. From what I can tell, the fan clutch mounts to water pump pulley, not the water pump itself. I tired to remove those 4 bolts on the clutch and the pulley spins. I tried gripping the pulley by hand and loosening the bolts to no avail. I'm reluctant to use vice grips or anything like that for fear of bending the pulley. Suggestions?
Again, thanks for all the help!!!
Jason
I just went out to the garage and took a quick peek. I see what you're saying about keeping the smog pump in its bracket and removing both as one piece.
What I'm not seeing is where the fan clutch meets the water pump. From what I can tell, the fan clutch mounts to water pump pulley, not the water pump itself. I tired to remove those 4 bolts on the clutch and the pulley spins. I tried gripping the pulley by hand and loosening the bolts to no avail. I'm reluctant to use vice grips or anything like that for fear of bending the pulley. Suggestions?
Again, thanks for all the help!!!
Jason
"You know, we always called each other goodfellas. Like you'd say to somebody: You're gonna like this guy, he's all right. He's a goodfella. He's one of us. You understand?"
Jasond56 said: F4Gary - Any tips/tricks/pit falls to watch out for? Do I need to worry about torquing to spec? I do not have torq wrenches...but I can invest in them if need be.
I've never used a torque wrench on an iron block water pump. As my grandfather used to say, tighten it down till it strips and back it off a 1/4 turn...
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Jason, to get the fan clutch off, you'll need to remove the four nuts next to the PULLEY, not the ones closest to the fan. Since you already have the belt(s) off, the best way to hold the pulley while loosening the nuts is with a long screwdriver. Wedge the screwdriver between one of the nuts/studs on the pulley, and then loosen one of the other nuts, while hold the screwdriver. Go around and loosen all four of the nuts first, then you'll be able to wrench them off easily.Don't be tempted to grip, or wedge the pulley itself...you'll wind up bending, or damaging it. Hold the pulley by the nuts...it won't hurt anything. Once you get the fan and pulley off, you'll see how it all attaches to the pump. Those four studs with the nuts are actually threaded into the WP shaft....
Keep track of any spacers, like the one on the smog pump bracket, and be sure to get them back in the correct location. Make sure you take note of the bolt lengths on all of the bolts....they're not all the same length, plus some have stud heads on them for other brackets to fit onto.
Make sure the block is dry when you're ready to reassemble everything. Use a small amount of silicon, or aviation sealer on the threads of the four bolts that hold the WP on....those bolts go thru to the water jacket.
If you really want to keep the original pump, assuming it IS the factory pump, you can do what I did. Buy a reman pump(NAPA, Autozone, etc), the take the guts out of that and install them in your original pump housing. Not really that hard to do, but it needs to be done carefully. I actually bought two reman pumps for mine. One I installed so I could drive the car, and the other I gutted when I was ready to rebuild my original, and put it back on the car.
|UPDATED|8/31/2015 7:32:04 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Keep track of any spacers, like the one on the smog pump bracket, and be sure to get them back in the correct location. Make sure you take note of the bolt lengths on all of the bolts....they're not all the same length, plus some have stud heads on them for other brackets to fit onto.
Make sure the block is dry when you're ready to reassemble everything. Use a small amount of silicon, or aviation sealer on the threads of the four bolts that hold the WP on....those bolts go thru to the water jacket.
If you really want to keep the original pump, assuming it IS the factory pump, you can do what I did. Buy a reman pump(NAPA, Autozone, etc), the take the guts out of that and install them in your original pump housing. Not really that hard to do, but it needs to be done carefully. I actually bought two reman pumps for mine. One I installed so I could drive the car, and the other I gutted when I was ready to rebuild my original, and put it back on the car.
|UPDATED|8/31/2015 7:32:04 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56 
My Link 
(click for Texas-sized view!) NCRS
"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"
Lifetime MemberModerator
Duncanville, TX - USA
Joined: 11/8/2003
Posts: 20214
Vette(s): #1-1974 L-48 4spd Cp Med Red Metallic/Black deluxe int w/AC/tilt/tele./p/w-p/b/
Am-Fm/map light National/Regional/Chapter NCRS "Top Flight"
#2-1985 Bright Red/Carmine Cp.L-98/auto
Member: NCRS, NCRS Texas, Corvette Legends of Texas
F4Gary said:I've never used a torque wrench on an iron block water pump. As my grandfather used to say, tighten it down till it strips and back it off a 1/4 turn...
Hmmm...I was always told to tighten until JUST before it strips....
Joel Adams
C3VR Lifetime Member #56
My Link
(click for Texas-sized view!) NCRS
"Money can't buy happiness -- but somehow it's more comforting to cry in a CORVETTE than in a Kia"
in Forum: C3 Engines
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