Topic: GM -366ci vs 350ci
in Forum: C3 Engines
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Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
I found an article to support my assertion in previous post.
Chevrolet offered an all-new engine for 1958 -- the W-block 348 (which would eventually grow into the famed 409). Paired with the year-old Turboglide transmission, the 348 looked good on paper; especially the 315hp version equipped with three two barrel carbs. But most 348s could still be regularly outrun by the lighter, high-winding 283s. It would take a few more cubic inches before these early "big-blocks" would earn more performance respect.
The '59s were most notable under the hood, where an optional V-8 engine produced up to 315 bhp. This "burner" thrived during the "more power" competition between the manufacturers.
The SS Impala and its optional 409-cid V-8 quickly proved itself on the performance circuit. One of the first cars equipped with this new powerhouse blew away the competition at the 1961 Winternationals Drag Racing Championships, held in Pomona, California. In fact, the 409, coupled with a four-speed transmission and some handling extras, placed the Impala SS among the world's fastest automobiles at the time. For 1962, the SS package could be combined with an even gutsier, dual-quad, 409-horse 409.
http://www.antiquechevytrucks.com/Content/Engine%20Information/engine_intro_body.htm
Interesting tidbit
At one time there were 158 different versions of the small-block being produced by Chevrolet -that's a lot of different ways to get power.
One clarification I should add is that the 366 is a tall deck Mark IV block and is therefore only partially interchangeable with a regular mark IV
The short big block V8 has a deck height (centerline of crankshaft to cylinder deck measured along the centerline of the bore) of 9.80" and a height (centerline of crankshaft to top of engine along the center of the V) of 10.75". Cylinders are spaced on 4.84" centers on each bank and the centers of cylinders on the two banks are offset to accommodate the two connecting rods on each crank journal. The big blocks have been produced in 3.935", 4.096", 4.125", 4.250", and 4.440" bores and strokes of 3.47", 3.76", and 4.00". Over the years from 1965 to 1995 the big blocks were offered in nine different displacements from 366 cid to 502 cid.
there appears to one more W big block also the Z11 (NOT ZL1)
How could we forget the legendary 409 cid engine first introduced in 1962. It evolved from another great engine the 348 cid V8 that ruled the road from 1958 to 1962. My 1961 Chevy had a 348 with the tri-power option putting out advertised 330 HP and with a 4.56 rear end it was unbeatable up to about 90 mph. The 348 was bored and stroked until it displaced 409 cubic inches. The 409 engine was pure muscle; full sized Chevys turned 12.55 quarter miles at 116 mph. The cam, valves, compression ratio of 10.2:1, head design and large dual exhausts all worked together to produce one of the most exciting engines in history. It was available in the Impala, but hot rodders in the know preferred their 409 in the lighter Bel Air body. The 409 was a great engine but Chevy needed something to answer the Chrysler 426 Max Wedge, the Ford 427 and the Pontiac Super Duty 421. In 1963 the 409 was stroked to 3.65" to produce 427 cid and along with liberal use of aluminum, special heads and intake manifold the Z11 engine/Impala was born. Officially rated at 430 HP, several sources suggest that actual output was significantly higher than 500 HP.
http://members.rogers.com/appster/text.january
Chevrolet offered an all-new engine for 1958 -- the W-block 348 (which would eventually grow into the famed 409). Paired with the year-old Turboglide transmission, the 348 looked good on paper; especially the 315hp version equipped with three two barrel carbs. But most 348s could still be regularly outrun by the lighter, high-winding 283s. It would take a few more cubic inches before these early "big-blocks" would earn more performance respect.
The '59s were most notable under the hood, where an optional V-8 engine produced up to 315 bhp. This "burner" thrived during the "more power" competition between the manufacturers.
The SS Impala and its optional 409-cid V-8 quickly proved itself on the performance circuit. One of the first cars equipped with this new powerhouse blew away the competition at the 1961 Winternationals Drag Racing Championships, held in Pomona, California. In fact, the 409, coupled with a four-speed transmission and some handling extras, placed the Impala SS among the world's fastest automobiles at the time. For 1962, the SS package could be combined with an even gutsier, dual-quad, 409-horse 409.
http://www.antiquechevytrucks.com/Content/Engine%20Information/engine_intro_body.htm
Interesting tidbit
At one time there were 158 different versions of the small-block being produced by Chevrolet -that's a lot of different ways to get power.
One clarification I should add is that the 366 is a tall deck Mark IV block and is therefore only partially interchangeable with a regular mark IV
The short big block V8 has a deck height (centerline of crankshaft to cylinder deck measured along the centerline of the bore) of 9.80" and a height (centerline of crankshaft to top of engine along the center of the V) of 10.75". Cylinders are spaced on 4.84" centers on each bank and the centers of cylinders on the two banks are offset to accommodate the two connecting rods on each crank journal. The big blocks have been produced in 3.935", 4.096", 4.125", 4.250", and 4.440" bores and strokes of 3.47", 3.76", and 4.00". Over the years from 1965 to 1995 the big blocks were offered in nine different displacements from 366 cid to 502 cid.
there appears to one more W big block also the Z11 (NOT ZL1)
How could we forget the legendary 409 cid engine first introduced in 1962. It evolved from another great engine the 348 cid V8 that ruled the road from 1958 to 1962. My 1961 Chevy had a 348 with the tri-power option putting out advertised 330 HP and with a 4.56 rear end it was unbeatable up to about 90 mph. The 348 was bored and stroked until it displaced 409 cubic inches. The 409 engine was pure muscle; full sized Chevys turned 12.55 quarter miles at 116 mph. The cam, valves, compression ratio of 10.2:1, head design and large dual exhausts all worked together to produce one of the most exciting engines in history. It was available in the Impala, but hot rodders in the know preferred their 409 in the lighter Bel Air body. The 409 was a great engine but Chevy needed something to answer the Chrysler 426 Max Wedge, the Ford 427 and the Pontiac Super Duty 421. In 1963 the 409 was stroked to 3.65" to produce 427 cid and along with liberal use of aluminum, special heads and intake manifold the Z11 engine/Impala was born. Officially rated at 430 HP, several sources suggest that actual output was significantly higher than 500 HP.
http://members.rogers.com/appster/text.january
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As I said, I was not sure. Good research. Do you remember the odd valve cover engine. Again the 409? Some one has to remember that thing.
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
| kstyer said: As I said, I was not sure. Good research. Do you remember the odd valve cover engine. Again the 409? Some one has to remember that thing. |
that was way before my time..
Ive only read about them.. and the beach boys song is one of my favorites. but ive never actually seen, much less worked on a 348 or 409
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
here is a picture of a 409 in a 61 impala SS
and suddenly the "W" motor becomes glaringly obvious
and suddenly the "W" motor becomes glaringly obvious
Lifetime MemberHot Springs, AR - USA
Joined: 4/24/2004
Posts: 3236
Vette(s): 69 Conv #'s match 427, TKO-600/.64, 3.36HD-Posi, HT, T/T, PS, PB, PW, SP, Leather, Comp XE264HR & Roller Rockers & Lifters, Air-Gap RPM intake, Holley St Av 770 VS, MSD 6AL+Dist+Blaster SS, K&N, Jet-Hot Hooker Side-Pipes, Steeroids, Al Rad, Spal Fans
wow this thread took me in a whole new direction..
ive been doing some research on the W motors and especially the Z11 (thats Z eleven) 427 motor.. that was pretty damn cool back in the day.. it was offered in a few cars in 63.. such as impala ss
here is a page with a guy restoring this beast..
http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/hanksz11page/
it wasnt as technologically advanced as the L-88 but the gross horsepower was roughly the same....
I had never heard of this beast before tonight..
very cool.
ive been doing some research on the W motors and especially the Z11 (thats Z eleven) 427 motor.. that was pretty damn cool back in the day.. it was offered in a few cars in 63.. such as impala ss
here is a page with a guy restoring this beast..
http://www.angelfire.com/extreme4/hanksz11page/
it wasnt as technologically advanced as the L-88 but the gross horsepower was roughly the same....
I had never heard of this beast before tonight..
very cool.
I'm telling my age Ken, but I vividly remember those old engines. 2 of my all time favorite cars are the 61 and 58 Impala. In my dream world they are both white convertibles and powered by the 348 Tri-Power!
Oh yeah, red interior!
Every once in a while they pop up at shows around here.
I also remember the 62 Bel Air with the 409, Appearance was basic, I've only seen them in Black with the large back glass and small hubcaps. Sound familiar?
Oh yeah, red interior!
Every once in a while they pop up at shows around here.
I also remember the 62 Bel Air with the 409, Appearance was basic, I've only seen them in Black with the large back glass and small hubcaps. Sound familiar?
OK Ben, here's one for you......... If memory serves, there exists a tall deck 427 that was used in trucks. The only part that would interchange with a standard 427 was the crank, which was steel (forged).
David, yes it sounds very familar. Those were some sweet old machines. I always liked the white with red. I had forgot about the big window, buy yes. Nice to know I was not losing my mind.
Ahh... the memories come back. I was quite young when they were new, but saw them on the road again later. They worked on a few even later. But that was along time ago from the last one.
And I would have never thought of it, but I also remember the tall deck truck 427. I needed some parts for that one when I learned about it.
I'm not nuts. There were different big blocks. All big blocks, but not all the same. Hey Jim, that means we get to stay out of the funny farm a bit longer.
Glad for the memory jogger. Thanks.
|UPDATED|8/21/2004 8:40:47 AM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Ahh... the memories come back. I was quite young when they were new, but saw them on the road again later. They worked on a few even later. But that was along time ago from the last one.
And I would have never thought of it, but I also remember the tall deck truck 427. I needed some parts for that one when I learned about it.
I'm not nuts. There were different big blocks. All big blocks, but not all the same. Hey Jim, that means we get to stay out of the funny farm a bit longer.
Glad for the memory jogger. Thanks.
|UPDATED|8/21/2004 8:40:47 AM (AZT)|/UPDATED|
Ken, I'm glad I could make you feel better! I was 10 when the '62 came out, but I can still the excitement when the new cars arrived at the dealers! Unlike now, 250,000 different makes and models that all look the same.
BTW, my oldest son is working for a Chevrolet dealer and he was chosen to take a C-6 and an SSR to Virginia Speedway for a debut! Some jobs don't suck! He's helped me on vettes since he was little, so he really has an appreciation for this!
BTW, my oldest son is working for a Chevrolet dealer and he was chosen to take a C-6 and an SSR to Virginia Speedway for a debut! Some jobs don't suck! He's helped me on vettes since he was little, so he really has an appreciation for this!
in Forum: C3 Engines
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