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Topic: timing chain and pan drop questions

in Forum: C3 Engines

timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/6/10 5:32pm Message 11 of 23
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York, PA - USA
Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
Vette(s): 1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top
Wow that sounds fun!! I have never done a chain with both sprockets at 12:00..??Knee jerk reaction would be that the cam is really on the exhaust stroke??  which valve starts to move when you trun the crank a little..(clockwise)I bet the exhaust valve moves..if not I had a long last night and a long day!!!The brain has been off since friday around noon!!SmileThe race way is to use a degree wheel..lot a work and not really needed for a driver that doesn't have an adjustable cam gear!!
Rich
 




My first parade at Carlisle 2010
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timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/6/10 7:46pm Message 12 of 23
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Red Lion, PA - USA
Joined: 10/27/2006
Posts: 1182
Vette(s): 1974 White 350 Corvette, TH400 Automatic 1972 Tangerine /Go Mango Convertible 383 Stroker, 2004r Automatic
Rich,
I remember a post where there was and is still an ongoing question about where the timing marks should be. http://www.c3vr.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=78597&OB=DESC
This is the link to the discussion. Let many others here I also always make marks at 12 and 6. Interesting conversation in these posts!
Rodney




timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/6/10 7:54pm Message 13 of 23
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Bloomfield Hills, MI - USA
Joined: 6/29/2008
Posts: 199
Vette(s): 1975 Corvette coupe, 4 speed manual, 383 ci 9.5:1,Edelbrock dual plane Air Gap intake, Alum Heads,Comp Cam, roller Rockers, PS,PB,Tilt
when you go for a new oil pan gasket; the one piece Felpro's work great.


timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/6/10 9:24pm Message 14 of 23
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Vancouver, WA - USA
Joined: 8/25/2005
Posts: 869
Vette(s): 1976 Silver/Firethorn. L48, 4spd. Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.
Re: the debate about 12/12 or 12/6: In the other thread someone came to the conclusion that it doesn't really matter -- either one works.  If both of mine were at 12:00 and I rotated the cam to 6:00, #1 is still on TDC, but it would simply "change" to the exhaust stroke from the compression stroke. (And I am sure it was on compression when I took everything apart) It becomes more complicated for me, though, as my distributor (and manifold) is out as well.  If I rotated my cam 180 degrees now, I would have to install the dist exactly 180 out when I put it back in.  So I'm going to line up the new timing set with a straightedge as Joel says and hope I get it right.  If the distributor were in, rotating the cam would take care of rotating the dist and everything would be fine.  Anyway....

So since I have my oil pan off I guess I should replace the oil pump as well?  How often do those fail? Engine has about 75K miles on it.   I was looking at Advance Autoparts and it looks like I could get a Melling high volume pump for about $30 or $40.  




 

1976 Silver/Firethorn.  L48, 4spd.  Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.

timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/6/10 9:25pm Message 15 of 23
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Vancouver, WA - USA
Joined: 8/25/2005
Posts: 869
Vette(s): 1976 Silver/Firethorn. L48, 4spd. Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.
Yep, already got the one piece Felpro - seems like it'll be a lot easier than the older four piece things...



 

1976 Silver/Firethorn.  L48, 4spd.  Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.

timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/7/10 5:50am Message 16 of 23
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York, PA - USA
Joined: 5/18/2010
Posts: 1518
Vette(s): 1969 daytona conv. all original 350 350 380 4 sp w/air..and hard top
Well its Tuesday morning! I would replace the pump if you have it taken apart as far as you do..when you pick up the pump see if it has that plastic line up collar for the pump to shaft..those do fall apart at times...and a pump gasket..maybe since this is so far apart you could do the plugs and wires like Ebo! Is that gasket a neoprene style or cork..oil pan gasket? Cork worked good if you glue it on with that black airplane glue.. I like the neoprene though..I will let the gear thing die because it really doesn't matter unless you are trying to line up the distributor.
Rich






My first parade at Carlisle 2010

timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/7/10 11:05pm Message 17 of 23
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Vancouver, WA - USA
Joined: 8/25/2005
Posts: 869
Vette(s): 1976 Silver/Firethorn. L48, 4spd. Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.
I think my original pump still has the collar (there's an orange sleeve thing on the shaft) but I'll probably get all new stuff.  Plugs and wires should be OK now, but I do agree having all this stuff off would make that job much easier.  The one piece Felpro is not cork and I don't think it's neoprene, either.  It's a blue rubber material on the outside, but it has some type of rigid spine inside.  The bolt holes have metal reinforcements.  I've talked with a few folks now that recommend them.  



 

1976 Silver/Firethorn.  L48, 4spd.  Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.

timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/9/10 8:28am Message 18 of 23
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Mounds View, MN - USA
Joined: 5/24/2007
Posts: 1031
Vette(s): 70 LT1 coupe, 69 350 HP coupe, 69 390HP 427 coupe, 71 LS5 convert, 85 coupe, 93 coupe
Back to the 12/6 debate.  If you do not remove your distributor, it doesn't matter at all which way you line up the marks.  The cam runs a half the crank speed, and the distributor runs off the cam.  It is correct that if you put the cam at 12:00, #1 will be on the top of the exhaust stroke rather than the firing position, but the distributor has turned with it, so # 6 will be firing.  The only time you need think about firing is if you take out the distributor, in which case you need to start over and turn the engine to #1 firing before reinstalling the distributor.

Larry



timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/9/10 9:16pm Message 19 of 23
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Vancouver, WA - USA
Joined: 8/25/2005
Posts: 869
Vette(s): 1976 Silver/Firethorn. L48, 4spd. Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.
I agree, but my distributor IS out. 

Distributor rotor was pointing close to #1 when I took the distributor out.   When I took the balancer off, it was pointing at TDC.  When I got the timing cover off, both marks were at 12:00.  I am sure everything is factory - it doesn't look like anything has ever been touched since it left St. Louis.  Is it possible some engines were built with both marks lined up with #6 (NOT #1) at TDC on compression? From reading the other thread it sure sounds like some manuals say it is one and others say it is the other.   Well, my plan is to put everything back the way I found it.  I won't rotate the cam, unless it is for a one or two tooth adjustment, and I'll put the distributor back in so the rotor is at #1.  Sound kosher?  This is kind of an interesting debate, though..... 




 

1976 Silver/Firethorn.  L48, 4spd.  Original 2 bolt, vortec heads, 9.4:1 CR, Speed Pro Cam: 224/224@0.050, 112 LSA, Eagle Steel Crank.

timing chain and pan drop questions

Posted: 9/10/10 2:59pm Message 20 of 23
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Dunedin, FL - USA
Joined: 3/21/2006
Posts: 262
Vette(s): 1980 Corvette Torch Red with Gold metallic 370HP/350 CU.IN.Turbo 350 w/shift kit.Originally CA.Car with 305 CU.IN.
 
Good Afternoon All,
 
       If you go to You Tube and type in the head line below you will see DVD of a timing chain/gear installed as it has been done since 1965 on Chevy engines..It always set 6 o'clock position for the cam gear and 12 for the crank gear, this is top dead center #1 when you rotate 180 degree you are now at #6 firing.....
 
       Take care all,
           Sal C
 
     
 
 
[YOU TUBE]  CHEVY ENGINE REBUILD CAMSHAFT TIMING CHAIN INSTALLATION DVD
 
 
 
 
 



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