>I think the vast differences in compensation between victims of the
September 11 casualty and those who die serving the country in Uniform are
profound. No one is really talking about it either, because you just don't
criticize anything having to do with September 11. Well, I just can't let the
numbers pass by because it says something really disturbing about the
>entitlement mentality of this country. If you lost a family member in the
September 11 attack, you're going to get an average of $1,185,000. The range is
a minimum guarantee of $250,000, all the way up to $4.7 million.
>
>If you are a surviving family member of an American soldier killed in
action, the first check you get is a $6,000 direct death benefit, half of which
is taxable.
>Next, you get $1,750 for burial costs. If you are the surviving spouse, you
get $833 a month until you remarry. And there's a payment of $211 per month for
each child under 18. When the child hits 18, those payments come to a screeching
halt.
>
>Keep in mind that some of the people who are getting an average of $1.185
million up to $4.7 million are complaining that it's not enough. Their deaths
were tragic, but for most, they were simply in the wrong place at the wrong
time. Soldiers put themselves in
>harms way FOR ALL OF US, and they and their families know the dangers.
>
>We also learned over the weekend that some of the victims from the Oklahoma
City bombing have started an organization asking for the same deal that the
September 11 families are getting. In addition to that, some of the families of
those bombed in the embassies are now asking for compensation as well.
>
>You see where this is going, don't you? Folks, this is part and parcel of
over 50 years of entitlement politics in this country. It's just really sad.
Every time a pay raise comes up for the military, they usually receive next to
nothing of a raise. Now the green machine is in combat in the Middle East while
their families have to survive on food stamps and live
>in low-rent housing. Make sense?
>
>However, our own US Congress just voted themselves a raise, and many of you
don't know that they only have to be in Congress one time to receive a pension
that is more than $15,000 per month, and most are now equal to being
millionaires plus. They also do not receive Social Security on retirement
because they didn't have to pay into the system.
>
>If some of the military people stay in for 20 years and get out as an E-7,
you may receive a pension of $1,000 per month, and the very people who placed
you in harm's way receive a pension of $15,000 per month.
>
>I would like to see our elected officials pick up a weapon and join ranks
before they start cutting out benefits and lowering pay for our sons and
daughters who are now fighting.
>
>"When do we finally do something about this?" If this doesn't seem
fair to you, it is time to forward this to as many people as you can.If your
interested there is more.......................
>
>This must be a campaign issue in 2004. Keep it going.
>
>SOCIAL SECURITY: (This is worth the read. It's short
>and to the point.)
>
>Perhaps we are asking the wrong questions during election years. Our
Senators and Congressmen do not pay into Social Security. Many years ago they
voted in their own benefit plan. In more recent years, no congressperson has
felt the need to change it. For all practical purposes their plan works like
this:
>When they retire, they continue to draw the same pay until they die, except
it may increase from time to time for cost of living adjustments. For example,
former Senator Byrd and Congressman White and their wives may expect to draw
$7,800,000 -- that's Seven Million, Eight Hundred Thousand), with! their wives
drawing $275,000.00 during the last years of their lives.
>
>This is calculated on an average life span for each.
>
>Their cost for this excellent plan is $00.00. These little perks they voted
for themselves is free to them. You and I pick up the tab for this plan.
>
>The funds for this fine retirement plan come directly from the General
Fund--our tax dollars at work! From our own Social
>Security Plan, which you and I pay (or have paid) into -- every payday until
we retire (which amount is matched by our employer) --we can expect to get an
average $1,000 per month after retirement. Or, in other words, we would have to
collect our average of $1,000 monthly benefits for 68 years and one month to
equal Senator Bill Bradley's benefits!
>
>Social Security could be very good if only one small change were made. And
that change would be to jerk the Golden Fleece Retirement Plan from under the
Senators & Congressmen. Put them into the Social Security plan with the rest of
us and then watch how fast they would fix it.
>
>If enough people receive this, maybe a seed of
>Awareness will be planted and maybe good changes will evolve. WE, each one
of us ... can make a difference. >



PS.But at least you said Italy,one of our supporters these days,if you had said France or Germany you should be shot!





|UPDATED|6/5/2004 10:51:29 PM (AZT)|/UPDATED|

From the sounds of this...I need to run for congress.

I either want less corruption or more participation.

but in reality i hate politicians and think the two party monopoly is a corruption of the framers intention..

show your disgust..

vote third party across the board

THank you for a wonderful thread that express the exact view that got me so much flack when i started to notice it about the 9.11.01 victims. People need to know the truth! Our men and women on the line need our support, the truth of what the are being paid needs to be told.

mark smith said:

Hey,Mark...dont believe I've seen a vette with that color...you have more pics? Yep,I've known for awhile our troops have been getting the monetary shaft! Shoot,a PFC is below the national poverty level.

Heres another little known piece of info that was relayed to me,that will piss you off further!.......Another item that the average American doesn't realize about the
Military retirement system and disability from the VA is this:

If a person completes at least 20 years of active military service,
retires, then applies for and recieves V.A. disability compensation, the
amount of V.A. disability is deducted dollar for dollar from the
retirement amount.
Example: A person retires after 30 years, the monthly retirement check
is $3000.00, that person is 100% disabled, the V.A. amount is $2100.00,
that amount is deducted from the retirement amount each month, leaving
a taxable retirement amount of $900.00. So after serving 30 years, and
becoming 100% disabled, the person's only net benefit is that the
taxable income is reduced.
Now to be fair, in Jan 2004, we began recieving a partial payment back
each month. The amount was based on the actual percentage of V.A.
disability each person is rated. These payments will continue to grow for
the next 10 years until the disabled veterans have their full monthly
retirement compensation returned to them in the year 2014, that is if they
survive that long.
Military veterans are the only Government employees that, under an
antiquated law dating back to the Civil War, cannot recieve concurrent
reciept of both retirement and V.A. disability compensation.
Congress in 2004 has tried to right this wrong. Unfortunately it was
too late for many who were deserving of more after returning from wars
fought for their country, and freeing the rest of the world.

A very interesting and lively discussion. Some additional fuel for the fires.

Historically, the sacrifices of the ordinary foot soldiers have always been marginalized. This was true of the ancient Egyptians, the Romans, and the Greeks. It was true of Alexander's army and of Hannibal's. It was true during the crusades, the American Revolution, the French Revolution, the Franco-Prussian War, the War of 1812, the American Civil War. It was not until the creation of the G.I. Bill (following World War II) that any nation extended consideration/appreciation/reward to the enlisted.

In part, nations did not compensate foot soldiers because they allowed their soldiers to compensate themselves through looting and plunder: hence, "To the victor belong the spoils." The U.S. government first denied soldiers this "opportunity" during the Civil War - and has increased the stricture against it in each succeeding war.

Historically you will also find that commanders and Generals (with only a very few exceptions) have been treated as "royalty" by the countries they served.

As to the compensation question, one important point has not been mentioned (or if it has, I have overlooked it). For the last thirty years the United States military has been an all-volunteer force. A primary element that one volunteers for is the opportunity to be trained for combat - to actively fight for one's country, whenever and wherever the poltical forces of this nation direct. In an all-volunteer military, the enlistee volunteers to die for his country (if need be) in exchange for job-training and room and board. I understood this bargain when I walked into a recruiter's office - and went in anyway.

The civilians who died September 11 had made no such bargain. Nor had the civilians in Oklahoma City.

As to the wretched excesses of our "elected" leaders, cthulhu's point is absolutely correct. The two-party system has become a vile power monopoly. Sadly, we have allowed this to happen through our collective indifference and our collective apathy. And we have allowed these swine to solidify their monopoly of power by buying into the crap that they spew from their lying faces. What's the easiest way to achieve victory against a numerically superior force? Divide it - and then conquer each part. That is precisely what we have allowed our so-called leaders to do. And they have prevailed by dividing us and comparing us on the bases of economics and ethnicity. They feint us by pointing to the billionaires or the welfare cheats or OPEC or some other facelessly unidentifiable enemy as the source of our individual discontent. And while they have us distracted, they sucker punch us with another automatic congressional pay raise or platinum parachute retirement or medical perk for themselves.

WAKE UP, AMERICA!! Your neighbor is not the enemy. The so-called conservative CITIZEN is not the enemy. The so-called liberal CITIZEN is not the enemy. These are just labels that the political power monopoly assaults our common sense with in an effort to distract us from their daily crimes against democracy, human decency, and "liberty and justice for all" right here in our own country.

John

PS - "I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just." Thomas Jefferson

I say we go back to the loot & plunder!

lumberjack said: WAKE UP, AMERICA!! Your neighbor is not the enemy. The so-called conservative CITIZEN is not the enemy. The so-called liberal CITIZEN is not the enemy. These are just labels that the political power monopoly assaults our common sense with in an effort to distract us from their daily crimes against democracy, human decency, and "liberty and justice for all" right here in our own country. John

power to the people john!!!!!!!!!!

once my wife has her doctorate we are expatriating to Italy (speed limit is 140km/h, 85mi/hr) so the vette is going to...

I was born American, I was proud to serve in USMC, but now that im a little older and wiser the politics of this country tick me off. I consider our republic (we dont live in a true democracy) to be a failure.

However I would stay if we can ever get John McCain elected Pres (at least until his terms are up)