My 1972 Coupe is only that because the VIN plate on the windshield post says so. Everything else about it is 1969. Somebody is messing with my head. The car was repainted in 1985 apparently and a new engine with the HP supposedly being raised from 350 to 400. I wastold to look on the topside of the frame behind the left rear wheel to find the VIN stamped there but I don't find anything. Is there anywhere else? Can anyone look at the numbers I have found and give any hint to find the original VIN of my 1969 Vette? The pictures etc can be seen at www.yardleyfarms.com/corvette.htm  

Sounds like you've got a problem, especially if law enforcement ever takes a look at the VIN. How is the car registered? As a '69. or a '72?
You can find one of the hidden VIN stamps on top of the frame rail, just behind the driver side rear tire, right about where the rear body mount is. You may need to do some cleaning in the area, and you'll need a mirror, and strong flashlight(or other good light source) to see the stamp. If there is a lot of paint on the frame, you may not be able to see it without scrapping the paint.


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I see by your title that the car is has been titled in both Indiana and Florida as a 1972. The vin tag definately matches the vin# on the titles. I agree with Joel that you have a problem with the DMV. I sincerely hope that you're not the vivtim of a chop shop. Please keep us informed as to what you find out. Good Luck!!

there are no legal issues at this point. Maybe when the first title was issued with the 1972 VIN there might be an issue but since then its all legal and correct. However, as a purist, this car is a 1969 though and through. Everything, not just a few parts. Is there anywhere else that the VIN could be found? I would rather avoid having to take the body off the frame so as to look under the driver side seat upper frame. The transmission numbers might offer a clue? the engine I think is a '76 but I am not certain. The spectre of a chop shop is there of course. We wonder what became of the '69 that 90% of this car is? what happened to the rest of the '72 car that it purports to be? Its hard to believe that someone would purposefully change a '69 to be  a '72 unless trying to hide something. I can understand going the other way for various reasons. Either way its tampering with a VIN which is a Federal Crime.

You won't have to take the body off the frame in order to retrieve the serial number. All you'll need is  some sandpaper, a good light and maybe a mirror. It's possible that someone had a salvage title for a 69 and set it on a 72 frame that they had a good title for.

after much effort, we have uncovered the original VIN on the rear frame: 194379S714476

[QUOTE=apostoln]after much effort, we have uncovered the original VIN on the rear frame: 194379S714476[/QUOTE]

and the transmission matches that VIN number (see www.yardleyfarms.com/corvette.htm where I have posted the pictures etc). Now comes the issue of what to do about it? How does one get a vehicle re-VINed? where can one get VIN info from before 1981 where only 13 digits were used? What happened to the vehicle that had the current 1972 VIN as in where is the body and frame of that vehicle now? what does the record show happened to the vehicle with my VIN?  Who and why was this switch done to begin with?

I know, some years ago, in some states (Florida being one of those), you could rebuild a totaled car and get it "re-vinned" and could get the "salvaged" removed from the title. This car may have been a totaled '69, was rebuilt, and a good VIN reissued. It was not illegal to do as long as you could prove that you spent enough $$ and actually rebuild the car. If the transfer states accept the title the way it is, the only problem is the fact that the car is a '69 with a reissued 72 VIN.

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I'd still be skeered of it if I ever went to sell it.
 Here's a theory, based on something I know for a fact happened.
You got one car ya want to build/drive, but no title. You have another car that is trashed, you do NOT want to repair, but...you have a valid title. What to do? Swap the VIN tag from the trashed car to the car you're going to drive. Now you have a drivable car with a title. Problem solved. Well...almost. In this case, the two cars were different year models. One, the driver, was a '77. The title car was an '81. So...the drivable car, while in reality is a '77 thru & thru, the title, and the VIN say it is an '81.
In this case, the VIN was transferred to the other car by cutting the windshield pillar off, with the VIN intact, and welding it to the windshield pillar of the other car. This kept the original rivets in place, undisturbed, and the welds completely hidden by the pillar post trim.
Illegal as h ell, and I washed my hands of the project when I heard what he did. I had already done all of the mechanical work, and he was ready for the paint/body work.
Last I heard, he still had the car, and couldn't get rid of it. Partly because of the horrendous body mods he did, and partly because everyone that looked at it to buy noticed the title discrepancy, since it was obviously NOT an '81 Corvette to start with.
Buyer beware, indeed....


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an authorized body shop could replace a rotting post and then re-affix the VIN to the new post. Nothing has really changed, the VIN is still affixed to the correct car. This car was NOT damaged or totalled, it IS very much intact and undamaged. It appears that someone somehow was trying to hide the 69 car by disguising it using a 72 VIN and probably the frame and body of that car was a total and is in actuality residing in a junk yard somewhere. My question is now what did someone somewhere report happened to the REAL VIN vehicle?

Good looking car, and a hell of a good price 13,900., the question is, is it illegal to have a registered 72 body on a 69 frame or visa versa, if not, try not to loose to much sleep over it and drive and enjoy the car,  if it is, tell the previous owner you want your money back, if he say no, then tell him you will be contacting your lawyer, law inforcement, and DMV of both states, this is not your fault, put the ball back in his court, either way its fd, if its not illegal, and it drives good, drive it for awhile turn it and get another with a lesson learned, I know, easy for me to say, but what other options do you have, I wish you luck!  anips2010-02-28 16:35:44

 think you are still missing the point. It is a 69 body on its correct 69 frame with its correct 69 transmission. Only the window frame is incorrect and belonged to a 72 car.

I am going to try to re-vin the car back to its original VIN.

The previous owner probably didn't know either since the title before his came as a 72.

The price was OK for a 72 but a good price for a real 69.

we will keep everyone posted.

another question?

I just hate to see or read about somebody trying to bastageize a corvette.  The latest issue of Corvette Magazine has a picture of a 64 coupe that was turned into a snow plow !!!!  The new owner got it and turned it back into a 64 !!!!!  A Snow Plow !!  Brings tears to my eyes just thinking about it!!

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The only legal way to replace the VIN plate is with the DMV's authorization, and usually that means a state issued, replacement VIN plate, and those are not normally configured.
Body shops and other repair shops have been swapping VIN plates for many years. You can buy the rosette type rivets on e-bay these days, even.
My opinion is, if you are swapping a damaged windshield post(on a Shark) for a new/replacement, swapping the VIN shouldn't be an issue, because the VIN plate is correct for the vehicle, and there is NO intent to defraud.
Putting a '72 plate on what is obviously NOT a '72 seems a wee bit fishy to me, but apparently, the title has been changed a few times, and no-one has raised any questions about it.

[quote=ranger3]Joel,

I'm curious. If you had a C3 Vette and the windshield frame/birdcage was completed rotted out and you gut the car to replace all of the metal, what happens to the VIN tag?

[/quote]
It would depend on what the guy doing the job wanted to do. As far as I know, by law the VIN plate has to be surrendered to the DMV in that situation. If the car was being rebuilt back to a drivable condition, the VIN could be replaced on the car, but Imma thinking the DMV is supposed to referee the actual installation of the VIN plate.
The state doesn't really keep that close a tab on all of this stuff, but they do sometimes send out inspectors. We had two come into a trans shop I was working at years ago, checking the VINs on the transmissions we had in stock. They were looking for any that might belong to vehicles that were reported as stolen. So...they do check every once and a while.


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Nicholas, I get your point, but its been registered in two states as a 72, and you didn't have any problems putting the title in your name, right, soo as far as is DMV is concerned its a 72, yes its obvious to us its a 69 and I know you want it right, I would too, but when the car came from out of state and the previous owner had it titled in your state the person that came out from behind the counter to check the VIN didn't know the difference also, so like I said as far as DMV is concerned its a 72, my point is who knows where this nightmare started, first thing I would do is run the frame #'s to see if it was on a hot list before I went to DMV to re VIN the car,  if some one had a stolen 69  and a totaled 72 thats all some thief would need to pull off a switch by welding in the 72's A pillar, I'am not trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill but Ive heard worse, if the car was stolen and you go to re VIN, then you get pulled into this thing, I suggest you run the numbers first BTW, if the car were not to be stolen and I don't know the laws in your state and you re VIN the car they might even issue a Special Construction title  which would be worse.anips2010-02-28 21:43:41

i do agree. However, I have run the both numbers on NICB and nothing shows as stolen or junked or waterlogged. Of course this could have happened 40 years ago so either way I assume statute of limitations would have run anyway. I would like to find a way to do a real Title VIN check on them both but since they are before 1981 its not readily done. Any clues as to how to get a complete check will be appreciated.

Can you tell me where to get a vin tag?

I can show title, frame, and damaged tag.

All match

Your 1st stop has to be a visit to your local law enforcement station. There they will provide you with paperwork showing the vehicle is not suspect or stolen.

From there they will send you to the BMV. I am not quite sure how your local BMV will approach your titlework. They may have you apply for an abandon title based on the absence of the original title in relationship to the original VIN numbers.

They might also assume that it is nothing more than a clerical error and send yours off to have the necessary corrections made.

Either way I don't see your title work as being too much of an issue. It would be interesting to know how this event came about but then....... some things are better off left alone,

                                                                       tux...        Tuxblacray2010-03-08 19:47:42

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I truly believe you got yourself a 1969 based on the trim tag,  gills in the body and all the other numbers that point to 1969 production. My guess is that there was either a birdcage corrosion issue or a bad accident and they got a replacement from a donor car and failed to switch the tags.

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Indiana has records back 10 years only. However, their purge files show the original VIN owned by an individual and an insurance company up to 1983. It seems to be an Indiana car since beginning. The 1972 VIN shows up as far back as 1992. It would appear that the rear upper body of the car was repaired or replaced. The frame does not appear damaged but some work appears to have been done to the cage left post and door area. 

The US DOT has no interest. The Florida DMV will come and verify that the real VIN should be what it is. Then what? Indiana would issue a State Issued VIN but we are not residents of Indiana so no go. The NICB won't talk to mere civilians. Sounds like a whole lot of folks doing very little to me. 

For whatever reason, what you have is a 1969 Corvette, with a title and  VIN plate from a 1972 Corvette. You stated that it showed to be "owned" by an insurance company at one time...that should tell you what has happened. The car was "totaled" as far as the ins. co. at some point, would be my bet.
I don't want to get into a big hu-bub about it, but my thoughts are, if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...it's a duck. Something is just not right about the whole thing, imho. If you can get the car registered as a '72 with no problems, that's kewl. Where I see a major problem will be trying to sell it...just doesn't seem right to sell it as a '72, since it's obviously not a '72.
I wish there was an easy solution for the problem, but there really isn't....


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